Besides Holyfield and Lewis, is there anyone else that you would have favored to have beaten Tyson in late 1996?

Aug 2, 2013
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I'm trying to think. Keep in mind, I'm talking Tyson that fought Holyfield the first time and was coming off the Seldon fight. Not anything before that post-prison who would have been rustier and not after he lost his mind and started smoking weed after the 2nd Holyfield fight.

I think Tyson would have squashed the fading Bowe that fought Golota and Golota himself. David Tua would have been an interesting fight as would have Ray Mercer. I can't think of any fighter that would have had a better than 50-50 shot though.
 
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tommygun711

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I think Ike Ibeabuchi would have had a great chance. Maybe David tua.

Mike had faded enough to the point that he was more hittable, his combination punching wasnt the same and his body work wasnt as consistent. He was still a very dangerous puncher, a hard fight for anybody but I think in order to beat that version of Mike you need to be able to come forward and you need a great chin.

Maybe an Old George Foreman could get it done.

@SwollenGoat
 
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I think Ike Ibeabuchi would have had a great chance. Maybe David tua.

Mike had faded enough to the point that he was more hittable, his combination punching wasnt the same and his body work wasnt as consistent. He was still a very dangerous puncher, a hard fight for anybody but I think in order to beat that version of Mike you need to be able to come forward and you need a great chin.

Maybe an Old George Foreman could get it done.

@SwollenGoat
I think Foreman was too old at that point to get it done. You might be right about Ike and Tua in having a shot. I recently watched Holyfield-Tyson 1 and I was thinking of the first 5 rounds of that fight especially Round 5 when Tyson was hitting Holyfield with some shots that would have taken almost any fighter down. I think Ike and Tua could have survived that. I definitely couldn't see Michael Moorer or Andrew Golota handling that. You're right in that he was a dangerous puncher and what made him dangerous is that he still had that great hand speed. I would have favored Lewis heavily in winning on points or a late knockout but it wouldn't have been the one sided beating it was in 2002.
 
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tommygun711

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I think Foreman was too old at that point to get it done. You might be right about Ike and Tua in having a shot. I recently watched Holyfield-Tyson 1 and I was thinking of the first 5 rounds of that fight especially Round 5 when Tyson was hitting Holyfield with some shots that would have taken almost any fighter down. I think Ike and Tua could have survived that. I definitely couldn't see Michael Moorer or Andrew Golota handling that. You're right in that he was a dangerous puncher and what made him dangerous is that he still had that great hand speed. I would have favored Lewis heavily in winning on points or a late knockout but it wouldn't have been the one sided beating it was in 2002.
I do think Foreman would have a better shot than you think. Stylistically he would be a rough fight for Tyson, he might bully Mike. A few years earlier, I think in 1991, Foreman performed much better against a more Prime holyfield than than Tyson did in 96'.. to be fair though the 91' Foreman was better than the '96 Foreman.
 
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I do think Foreman would have a better shot than you think. Stylistically he would be a rough fight for Tyson, he might bully Mike. A few years earlier, I think in 1991, Foreman performed much better against a more Prime holyfield than than Tyson did in 96'.. to be fair though the 91' Foreman was better than the '96 Foreman.
Yeah, I'm glad you pointed out the distinction between 1991 Foreman and 1996 Foreman. The 1991 version was in his early 40s and his work rate was alot higher than it was a few years later. There's no way in hell Crawford Grimsley and Shannon Briggs would have made it to the final bell against the 1991 Foreman. One of the things that gets underrated in heavyweight boxing is work rate. That is one of the reasons why I say that Tyson had more of a decline after the ear biting suspension as opposed to the decline after coming out of prison. Tyson still had fast hand speed and body movement after he came out of prison even if he wasn't the same fighter. After he got back from the ear biting suspension, he was not throwing punches in bunches and moving around as much as he did before it. His work rate after that had declined so much as well as his speed and that's why Tyson was so easy to beat for Lewis in 2002. Watch Tyson-Bruno 2 and the first 5 rounds of Holyfield 1 and compare his work rate in those 2 fights to any fight that he had after the ear biting suspension that went past the first round and you can easily see it.
 
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In '96?

I think Tommy Morrison might have had a puncher's chance. - It usually takes a big puncher to beat a big puncher.

(Or a big headbutter, but let's not go there. :hat)
 

tommygun711

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In '96?

I think Tommy Morrison might have had a puncher's chance. - It usually takes a big puncher to beat a big puncher.

(Or a big headbutter, but let's not go there. :hat)
I certainly wouldn't have picked Morrison - he had a very vulnerable chin.

also shout out to Tim Witherspoon. he was still a very good heavyweight in 1996.
 
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One Man

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In '96?

I think Tommy Morrison might have had a puncher's chance. - It usually takes a big puncher to beat a big puncher.

(Or a big headbutter, but let's not go there. :hat)
Tommy was actually signed to foght Mike back in 96 but with one ir two tune ups before.
The Stormy Weathers fight was one of those and offcourse he tested positive for HIV and everything went out.
 
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Aug 2, 2013
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In '96?

I think Tommy Morrison might have had a puncher's chance. - It usually takes a big puncher to beat a big puncher.

(Or a big headbutter, but let's not go there. :hat)
Tyson's chin was too good to get taken out by 1 or 2 punches. Even 6 years later when he was deteriorated even compared to 1996, he was able to take alot of flush shots from Lewis before going down. Guys with chins like Tyson, Holyfied, McCall, Mercer, etc. aren't the type of fighters where guys with puncher's chances have a chance to win. Those are the types of guys you have to beat by decision or a sustained beating to get a tko or ko win.
 
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tommygun711

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Tyson's chin was too good to get taken out by 1 or 2 punches. Even 6 years later when he was deteriorated even compared to 1996, he was able to take alot of flush shots from Lewis before going down. Guys with chins like Tyson, Holyfied, McCall, Mercer, etc. aren't the type of fighters where guys with puncher's chances have a chance to win. Those are the types of guys you have to beat by decision or a sustained beating to get a tko or ko win.
I still would have loved to see Tyson fight Tommy Morrison. You know they would be exchanging bombs from the start! Left hook galore.

here's a wild card for you, Yank.. How about Larry Holmes vs Mike Tyson II, circa 1996? Holmes had just gone the distance with Oliver McCall, and despite being ancient was still a very good fighter!

 
Aug 2, 2013
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I still would have loved to see Tyson fight Tommy Morrison. You know they would be exchanging bombs from the start! Left hook galore.

here's a wild card for you, Yank.. How about Larry Holmes vs Mike Tyson II, circa 1996? Holmes had just gone the distance with Oliver McCall, and despite being ancient was still a very good fighter!

Tyson vs. Morrison in 1996 would have been entertaining, I agree. I think it would have been a good and entertaining fight, probably a good 5 round battle with Tyson knocking him out.

Tyson-Holmes 2 in 1996? Probably a better fight than the first one but Tyson wins in the middle rounds. Holmes wasn't any worse than he was when they fought in 1988 when Tyson was at his peak and still managed to make it to round 4 against him and arguably win 1 of the rounds. Holmes might have even been better since he was more active and wasn't coming off an almost 2 year layoff.

Btw, this is one of the reasons why Holyfield should be ranked in the top 5 heavyweights of all time and not just top 10. Tyson was still a monster and a great fighter in 1996, he was still only 30 and Holyfield was still able to beat him even though Holyfield himself was past his best days. I really don't think anyone else in 1996 beats Tyson except for Lennox Lewis.
 
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I still would have loved to see Tyson fight Tommy Morrison. You know they would be exchanging bombs from the start! Left hook galore.

here's a wild card for you, Yank.. How about Larry Holmes vs Mike Tyson II, circa 1996? Holmes had just gone the distance with Oliver McCall, and despite being ancient was still a very good fighter!

Btw, that version of Larry Holmes would have kicked the shit out of any heavyweight right now outside of the big 3. He would have jabbed Ruiz's and White's face off.
 
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tommygun711

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Btw, this is one of the reasons why Holyfield should be ranked in the top 5 heavyweights of all time and not just top 10. Tyson was still a monster and a great fighter in 1996, he was still only 30 and Holyfield was still able to beat him even though Holyfield himself was past his best days. I really don't think anyone else in 1996 beats Tyson except for Lennox Lewis.
I mostly agree. He comes close to the top 5 for me. my top 10 heavyweights probably goes like this:

  1. Muhammad Ali
  2. Joe Louis
  3. Larry Holmes
  4. George Foreman
  5. Lennox Lewis
  6. Evander Holyfield
  7. Joe Frazier
  8. Mike Tyson
  9. Rocky Marciano
  10. Sonny Liston/Wladimir Klitschko
Then you got jack dempsey, jack johnson etc. Could throw in some others too like Vitali based on his head to head ability, MAYBE Tyson Fury if he beats Joshua and a few others.
 
Jun 6, 2013
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Tyson's chin was too good to get taken out by 1 or 2 punches. Even 6 years later when he was deteriorated even compared to 1996, he was able to take alot of flush shots from Lewis before going down. Guys with chins like Tyson, Holyfied, McCall, Mercer, etc. aren't the type of fighters where guys with puncher's chances have a chance to win. Those are the types of guys you have to beat by decision or a sustained beating to get a tko or ko win.
Probably true. Still, Tommy hit like a mule. I don't think tyson ever got hit with a hook that powerful. (And Morrison also had fast hands.)
It would have been an explosive fight, one way or another.
 
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tommygun711

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Probably true. Still, Tommy hit like a mule. I don't think tyson ever got hit with a hook that powerful. (And Morrison also had fast hands.)
It would have been an explosive fight, one way or another.
Razor Ruddock likely hit as hard if not harder than Morrison.


 
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Aug 2, 2013
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I mostly agree. He comes close to the top 5 for me. my top 10 heavyweights probably goes like this:

  1. Muhammad Ali
  2. Joe Louis
  3. Larry Holmes
  4. George Foreman
  5. Lennox Lewis
  6. Evander Holyfield
  7. Joe Frazier
  8. Mike Tyson
  9. Rocky Marciano
  10. Sonny Liston/Wladimir Klitschko
Then you got jack dempsey, jack johnson etc. Could throw in some others too like Vitali based on his head to head ability, MAYBE Tyson Fury if he beats Joshua and a few others.
Props

That's a really damn good list. I actually agree with all of your top 9 being in the top 10. I'd put Holmes in the bottom half of the top 10 and I'd rate Marciano a little higher, those are the only 2 major differences I'd put up.

  1. Ali
  2. Louis
  3. Foreman
  4. Holyfield
  5. Tyson
  6. Marciano
  7. Frazier
  8. Lewis
  9. Holmes
  10. Bowe
 
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