Biggest Overachievers in Boxing

Jun 3, 2012
13,554
13,203
Korakuen Hall
Who have you got?

I'd say Jamie McDonnell is one. He doesn't do anything particularly spectacular. But he was WBA champion for four years (plus a short stint with the IBF belt), and also won British, Commonwealth and European titles during a 21-fight win streak. Yet you could argue he lost 4-5 of those bouts, so he certainly had fortune on his side during that run.
 
Jul 6, 2019
342
348
30
Ricky Burns, Gavin Rees and Duke McKenzie come to mind for UK fighters.

Now for a couple of controversial suggestions for debate:

1. Calzaghe. Great fighter, and I was a big fan, but you wouldn't expect a pigeon chested, glass fisted fighter, with improper punch technique, to finish as an undefeated two weight world champ.

Was the man in two divisions, holds wins over two atg's and all while being trained by his dad in a shed. (fully aware of his various attributes, and some might argue he underachieved in terms of who he fought, but in terms of career stats he achieved more than most would expect if you were watching him fight for the first time).

2. Floyd Mayweather Jnr. An absolutely fantastic defensive fighter, his talent speaks for itself.

However, his smart, business-like approach to his career and matchmaking has allowed him to finish undefeated, and to beat a who''s who of boxing.

He was able to get a lot of fighters, (Canelo, Pac, Oscar) at a good time, and he was also able to avoid stylistically difficult fights such as Williams and Margarito.

Furthermore to earn the money he has, as a small, defensive, relatively light-punching fighter is a great achievement.

Had he come at a slightly different time, or dropped his 0 to castillo, he might have had a very different career. Would he be undefeated, or would anyone be arguing he could be TBE if was fighting during the era of Hearn's, Leonard, Duran and Pryor? Or even Oscar, Tito and Moseley?
 
Oct 27, 2016
1,176
2,383
UK wise Johnny Nelson 0-3 to having the longest undeafeated run for a CW champion.

Dennis Andries crude did a lot of things wrong but showed heart,guts and a determination to prove people wrong can take you a hell of a long way.
 
Jul 6, 2012
5,077
1,275
france
2. Floyd Mayweather Jnr. An absolutely fantastic defensive fighter, his talent speaks for itself.

However, his smart, business-like approach to his career and matchmaking has allowed him to finish undefeated, and to beat a who''s who of boxing.

He was able to get a lot of fighters, (Canelo, Pac, Oscar) at a good time, and he was also able to avoid stylistically difficult fights such as Williams and Margarito.

Furthermore to earn the money he has, as a small, defensive, relatively light-punching fighter is a great achievement.

Had he come at a slightly different time, or dropped his 0 to castillo, he might have had a very different career. Would he be undefeated, or would anyone be arguing he could be TBE if was fighting during the era of Hearn's, Leonard, Duran and Pryor? Or even Oscar, Tito and Moseley?
really interesting shout. but the marquez and canello wins look really really good now. and even the pac one as well.
 
Sep 22, 2014
1,967
1,728
The fist name that popped into my head was Ricky Burns.

Froch isn’t a bad shout at all either. For someone who at times was embarrassing bad technique wise, crossing his feet, slow as shit hands, etc they (I give McCraken a lot of credit) managed to develop a style that worked beautifully within his limitations and exploited his unbelievable engine and chin.

Amir Khan also has to be mentioned. I know he’s got incredible hand speed, but I really don’t rate his boxing IQ at all and we all know about that extremely questionable mandible, so to actually have had the career he’s had (clever enough match making!) is impressive and a testament to the fact he really does have balls like grapefruits.

How much of that is down to him being too thick to realise how deep he was in I’m not sure but I still give him credit. He basically had a career based on quick hands and being thick. Lol.

Thinking of Khan, I’d like to nominate one of my favourites, Marcos “El Chiiiiiino” Maidana. Crude, violent slugger, bought in as an opponent on more than a few occasions and slugged his way through to 2 massive paydays against Floyd, gave him the best fight of anyone in the last 5 years and retired off into the sunset to get fat and be happy.
 
Jul 6, 2019
342
348
30
really interesting shout. but the marquez and canello wins look really really good now. and even the pac one as well.
My thinking was that he is an overachiever because, even though he has fantastic ability and grounding, the names on his record are just so good that it's still an over achievement.

Canelo hadn't peaked, and jmm and pac were, ahem, maybe missing a certain something. But the wins have aged really well, increasing his achievements further.
 

Pedderrs

DKSAB
Jun 1, 2012
22,294
14,630
30
United Kingdom
My thinking was that he is an overachiever because, even though he has fantastic ability and grounding, the names on his record are just so good that it's still an over achievement.

Canelo hadn't peaked, and jmm and pac were, ahem, maybe missing a certain something. But the wins have aged really well, increasing his achievements further.
Canelo was an established world champion when he almost got shut out by an aging Floyd. You can slice it any way you want, it's a fantastic win and speaks to the ridiculous ability of one of the greatest fighters that have ever lived. To list Floyd Mayweather Jr in here is a little bit silly, frankly. The only way to make that argument is to discredit and dismiss his best wins, which you are doing here. Yeah, let's just dismiss dominant victories over Pac, Jmm and Canelo because they weren't peak, even those Floyd wasn't near his best either. The logic.
 
Jul 6, 2019
342
348
30
Canelo was an established world champion when he almost got shut out by an aging Floyd. You can slice it any way you want, it's a fantastic win and speaks to the ridiculous ability of one of the greatest fighters that have ever lived. To list Floyd Mayweather Jr in here is a little bit silly, frankly. The only way to make that argument is to discredit and dismiss his best wins, which you are doing here. Yeah, let's just dismiss dominant victories over Pac, Jmm and Canelo because they weren't peak, even those Floyd wasn't near his best either. The logic.
Ha. I am not trying to descredit anyone, it's a light hearted discussion and I chose to approach it from a different angle to spark some debate, (and for my own amusement).

Floyd is clearly a great fighter, and I have made good money backing him over the years. I also reckon he beats Pac and JMM handily at any point in their careers.

Canelo wasn't at his peak, and would clearly be a more difficult proposition now, doesn't diminish the win though. He was still good then and already had a very good CV.

My argument that he over achieved is not because he is untalented, far from it, but because it would be easy for a fighter, even with his great gifts, to achieve much less if he were not so savvy.

No one has mastered the business side of boxing better than Floyd in this era.
 

Ar558a

Fighting the Fury loving Scum
Jun 2, 2019
504
152
I'm Amazed this thread has been up more than 24 hrs without some saying AJ in an attempt to wind me up. :think1
 

DB Cooper

peel me a grape
May 17, 2013
17,932
4,683
UK wise Johnny Nelson 0-3 to having the longest undeafeated run for a CW champion.

Dennis Andries crude did a lot of things wrong but showed heart,guts and a determination to prove people wrong can take you a hell of a long way.
Nelson is a great call. Most guys would have quit well before he got any good.
 
Reactions: Bob Weaver