Thanks Duo!
I really appreciate your thoughtful and comprehensive response. Like you, I have a lot of admiration for Joe Frazier in and out of the ring. I have heard of numerous incidents in which people who met him came away admiring him more then before they met.
Though I was aware that he had some serious shoulder issues I've never been able to find out to the extent he was hampered by them. As you pointed out, he does not seem like someone who would discuss physical challenges that he was facing never mind use them as an alibi for performance in the ring. I don't think the world got to see Smokin Joe at his Peak following the Fight of the Century. While his hospitalization following the first fight Muhammad Ali is well-known the specific circumstances still seems somewhat mysterious. I suspect that the kidney and hypertension from which he suffered for bigger issues than people understand.
I also believe that you were raised a very good point regarding his effective right hand. It is mind numbing the number of so called boxing aficionados who claimed that Joe was a one-armed fighter. In addition to the fights you point it out Chuvalo and Ellis also provide excellent examples of its effectiveness.
I'm always amazed when people question his durability and chin following his loss to Foreman. I don't think there is ever been another fighter in history has been lifted off his feet buy a punch and still had ability and the heart to get back and carry on. Thank you again, and I look forward to any information or insight that you may have in the future.
His long right hand tore open Jerry Quarry's face in their rematch, causing JQ to turn his back in concession. (Gerry Cooney's right also ripped open Jimmy Young's face in round three, suddenly turning the overall complexion of their bout around, as Jimmy was only able to complete another round before having to be withdrawn.)
George Chuvalo's been outspoken about the potency of Frazier's right. Although there have been noted boxers who were one armed punchers (Marciano was essentially a right handed slugger until surprising Louis and Matthews with his Charley Goldman cultivated hook, and I haven't pinpointed a prominent right handed punch from either Henry Cooper or Pinklon Thomas. Meanwhile Coetzee does deck Knoetze with a fourth round hook in their punch for pay finale and otherwise makes fine use of his hook, while Ingo did jab his way to clinch the decision over Brian London without his "Bingo" right, to barely be rescued at the end by the final bell.)
Smoke was at his peak for three bouts in 1969 and 1970 as I see it. What elevated him to ATG level was the Championship Distance of Bonavena II in December 1968, an experience which removed all questions about his endurance and ability to go a full 15. (Floyd Patterson's absence of any Championship Rounds experience cost him dearly against Jimmy Ellis as Floyd overpaced, although I thought Patterson won anyway, but Floyd would have competed with a lot more conviction in another such contest.)
Physical peak bouts were against opponents not quite up to snuff. Dave Zyglewicz (first round knockout mismatch win), Jerry Quarry I (where Joe threw a sustainable 64 total punches in the opening round to JQ's rapidly exhausting 93 punches with 57 hooks, 20 of those hooks to Smoke's body in the first three minutes), before consolidating the HW Title in Jimmy Ellis I. It was after Ellis I that Frazier fractured his ankle, so there's long been speculation among truly knowledgeable boxing aficionados that he was actually past his true peak for Bob Foster I.
Jerry Quarry II was a masterpiece. Eddie Futch reminded him that Jerry was the same height and reach, and might be outjabbed and surprised by the right hands Joe did not use as much in their first bout. In fact, Jerry was confused. He tried moving back and counterclockwise, but was thwarted by Frazier's slightly longer and better extended jab. (Joe was also noticeably stronger than Jerry at close quarters physically, quickly shoving JQ's arms out of the way to open him up.)
Not as slow a starter as commonly stereotyped. He decked the rugged veteran Eddie Machen in the opening round, many referees would have scored an opening round knockdown against Ramos (as the film suggests only the ropes kept Manuel on his feet), decked an immediately hard attacking Ziggy 13 seconds in with his sixth punch (the third of three hooks set up by a jab), and Smoke set up the knockout hook with a vicious right uppercut in close.
Terry Daniels was also floored near the end of the opening stanza, and while Frazier won the first round over Bob Foster, he could just as easily have wiped out BF as quickly in one as he did in the second round. He was never the truly slow starter that Duane Bobick was (by Duane's own admission after unable to stop four successive lead rights by John Tate), Ken Norton (except against Bobick) Carlos Palomino, Michael Spinks, Danny Lopez, Bob Foster or some other noted as powerful punchers tended to be. (I leave Lyle out of this group, because Ron always choose to use the opening round as a feeling out process, even though he could have dispatched many of his opponents out the gate. Everybody knew this. Duane Bobick was definitely NOT somebody Lyle would have allowed to survive the first three minutes. Nor would have Duane's manager, Frazier himself, in a situation where we definitely would have seen Joe's right being deployed quickly.)
Why did he get this reputation as a slow starter? His own words, repeated by Cosell, then taken way out of context, that Joe was "seldom at his best in the first round" (seldom does not mean "never"), that it took him a round or two to "really start smokin,'" a completely rational approach for an attrition oriented body punching specialist in the opening rounds of the Championship Distance. Finding timing, distance, rhythm, and warming up an arthritic body to the commencement of actual competition also factors in, but footage does exist of him disregarding the body in favor of a quick Tysonesque dispatch.
I'm among those who agree he doesn't get enough credit for Foreman II. In conceding the opening rounds to George, he moved around in a way not demonstrated since Stander, got out of several tight spots, and boxed intelligently within his limitations, banking on the fact GF had never produced a knockdown beyond round five. In fact, Frazier did last the longest on his feet of any opponent Foreman dropped prior to George's comeback over a decade later. (Foreman knew what Joe was trying, and was accordingly patient. Frazier's hook retained the power of Manila, but he'd have needed to finish swelling George's right eye with it, then somehow drag Foreman into the double digit rounds. As soon as GF was in danger of being blinded to that hook following round four though, he went for the kill.)
Although Jimmy Cannon wrote after Frazier-Bonavena I that Joe didn't really have the chin to support his style of fighting, and never had the opportunity to defeat a first rate HW puncher during his peak (Mac Foster would have tested him if JQ hadn't gotten in Mac's way) Machen, Mathis, JQ and Ellis were respectable punchers with skills and quick fists who produced impressive one punch knockdowns and knockouts of noted HWs. (Anybody could stop Wepner on cuts, but big Buster put Chuck on the floor in the opening round, not after exhausting him over 15 like Ali later did. Probably helped that Mathis outweighed Wepner by 50 pounds when they had their early career meeting.)
Ellis dropped an onrushing Ringo with a single third round right, then a tenth round hook. Jimmy wasn't a good finisher, but with single punches from either hand, he could be extremely dangerous to charge after. (Frazier respected this. He never ran after Ellis the way he would later swarm and swamp the harmless Terry Daniels, and Bob Foster got through their opening round due to lack of recklessness on Smoke's part. A few months earlier, Jose Luis Garcia had beaten the crap out of his Futch trained buddy and spar mate Ken Norton. Garcia was the same height and weight which BF checked in at to challenge Smoke, and Ken outweighed the Venezuelan string bean by the same 20 pound margin the thicker and fire hydrant stumpier Frazier carried against Bob. Joe knew it was a mismatch, and knew he had a much better chin, faster start and far better training habits in coming back from his broken ankle than Norton came into Garcia I with, but Bob Foster was also a much more accomplished opponent than Garcia, and Smoke wasn't going to be stupid with BF.)
Muhammad Ali, at his strongest and hardest punching, hit Frazier more times in 41 rounds of competition than all Joe's other opponents probably put together, and only came close to dropping Smoke with that driving right in round two of their middle bout. Nobody had previously swelled Frazier's face prior to the FOTC like Ali did in 1971. (Smoke was completely unmarked after seven rounds of trench warfare with JQ in 1969.) Foreman has consistently rated Ali fifth in power of all George's opponents. Frazier's face simply would not have swelled up like it did in the FOTC and Manila, unless he was getting repeatedly punched with sustained force. (With their styles and height differential, Muhammad was certainly not doing it in the trenches with head butts, shoulders and elbows, Joe never suggested he did, and Padilla made sure it was a clean fight decided by punches.)