ESPN The Last Dance Documentary

Bachafach^^^

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I just don't see how anybody who saw both players at their peak can put forth an argument for LeBron being the GOAT. GOATs don't disappear in finals like LeBron did in the 2011 finals.

Everytime it mattered in the finals Jordan showed up. Dude has 6 finals mvp. Nobody else has more than 3.
In 1989 Jordan and the Bulls were up 2-1 on the Pistons in the Eastern conference finals and Jordan proceeded to go 9-26 from the field over the next 2 games, all lost by single digits. In Game 6 he has 8 turnovers and misses 7 free throws. The Bulls lose by 9 points. Then in 1990 gets blown the fuck out in game 7 losing to the Pistons again.

Imagine if social media and 24 hour sports cycle would've been around back then. Jordan had been in the league 8 years and couldn't make it to the finals.

That's a pressure Jordan never knew.
 
Jun 5, 2013
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Who gives a fuck about MVPs? It's a bullshit popularity contest. You might as well try to claim that the prom queen is the hottest girl in the school because she was voted prom queen. No, she's the most popular girl.

What is the MVP even awarded for? Is it the best player in the league/finals? Is it the best performer in the league/finals - the one who had the biggest impact on how the results turned out? Is it the guy who is a more crucial component to any success his team has than any other player was?

If you remove Jordan from his Chicago dynasty teams, they are still very much in the hunt for the title. Can you say that about LeBron's Cavs? If that's the case, who is a more valuable player? :thumbsup

:hat
Yes the regular season MVP is sometimes a popularity contest but the finals MVP generally always goes to the guy who had the biggest impact in that series. No other player, on either team had a bigger impact in the finals than Jordan.

I'm not trying to slight LeBron who I have as the 3rd greatest player of all time. But he ain't Jordan. 2011 will always be an albatross around his neck. Dude came up small and frankly looked shook.
 
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Jun 5, 2013
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In 1989 Jordan and the Bulls were up 2-1 on the Pistons in the Eastern conference finals and Jordan proceeded to go 9-26 from the field over the next 2 games, all lost by single digits. In Game 6 he has 8 turnovers and misses 7 free throws. The Bulls lose by 9 points. Then in 1990 gets blown the fuck out in game 7 losing to the Pistons again.

Imagine if social media and 24 hour sports cycle would've been around back then. Jordan had been in the league 8 years and couldn't make it to the finals.

That's a pressure Jordan never knew.
Yeah but what happened when he finally reached the finals? No other superstar ate on his watch. Not Barkley, not Ewing, not the Mailman or Stockton

Plenty of other superstars ate during LeBron's reign
 
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Yeah but what happened when he finally reached the finals? No other superstar ate on his watch. Not Barkley, not Ewing, not the Mailman or Stockton

Plenty of other superstars ate during LeBron's reign

Are you one of those guys who thinks that the finals are more important than any other playoff series? In the playoff every series is equally important.
 
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Are you one of those guys who thinks that the finals are more important than any other playoff series? In the playoff every series is equally important.
Why wouldn't the finals hold more weight than any other playoff series? How you perform in the finals should matter more than a first round match up against a 8th seed.

Easy to look good against a team that barely snuck in the playoffs
 
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Yeah apparently he's well known for being a total cunt. I can't remember who, but I remember hearing some black celebrity - a comedian or a musician - buying a Jordan game jersey at an auction and then running into Jordan at some event and telling him about it, and Jordan being a total cunt about it. That recollection probably doesn't do the story justice eh. :lol:

:hat
I was sitting there thinking it would take you all of 2 seconds to scribble your name down for the bloke but no. Jordan didn't even fuckin acknowledge him.
 
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Bachafach^^^

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Yeah but what happened when he finally reached the finals? No other superstar ate on his watch. Not Barkley, not Ewing, not the Mailman or Stockton

Plenty of other superstars ate during LeBron's reign
Well Jordan played 15 NBA seasons so unless he won 15 NBA championships somebody was eating.
 
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Why wouldn't the finals hold more weight than any other playoff series? How you perform in the finals should matter more than a first round match up against a 8th seed.

Easy to look good against a team that barely snuck in the playoffs

Jordan lost plenty before he got to the Finals. The series he lost were every bit as important as any finals he ever played in. If you lose any playoff series than you don't win a title.
 
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I guess what I'm trying to say is once he got to the top of mountain as far as winning championships, he kept winning championships. Nobody knocked him off the mountaintop. And contrary to belief the 90s had some good teams.

You got me defending a dude I don't really like. But I can't deny what I saw with my own 2 eyes. Jordan is the GOAT
 

Rattler

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A waste of time. Jordan had producing credit on this one, so there's no way it's a honest portrayal of anything notable.

Besides, I lived through the era of the media lathering Jordan's balls on a daily basis, so I don't need an abbreviated version of it.
 
Jun 5, 2013
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A waste of time. Jordan had producing credit on this one, so there's no way it's a honest portrayal of anything notable.

Besides, I lived through the era of the media lathering Jordan's balls on a daily basis, so I don't need an abbreviated version of it.
I'm actually enjoying it buts it's basically a MJ ass kissing anthology.
 
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Bachafach^^^

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A waste of time. Jordan had producing credit on this one, so there's no way it's a honest portrayal of anything notable.

Besides, I lived through the era of the media lathering Jordan's balls on a daily basis, so I don't need an abbreviated version of it.
Running home to watch NBA films and NBA inside stuff with Ahmad Rashad.


Its good the younger generations are finding out Jordan wasn't this infallible God.
 
Jul 23, 2017
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Yes the regular season MVP is sometimes a popularity contest but the finals MVP generally always goes to the guy who had the biggest impact in that series. No other player, on either team had a bigger impact in the finals than Jordan.

I'm not trying to slight LeBron who I have as the 3rd greatest player of all time. But he ain't Jordan. 2011 will always be an albatross around his neck. Dude came up small and frankly looked shook.
You can’t blame Lebron for that poor performance known damn well Delonte West was banging his mom. That shit will fuck up any mans head up going into a game. You think MJ could cope any better if he found himself in that same situation that Lebron was in in 2011?
 
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You can’t blame Lebron for that poor performance known damn well Delonte West was banging his mom. That shit will fuck up any mans head up going into a game. You think MJ could cope any better if he found himself in that same situation that Lebron was in in 2011?

Mum having sex > murdered father
 
Jul 23, 2017
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Mum having sex > murdered father
Not at all. Though both are traumatic situations for an individual to find hes/her self in in the midst of an important purpose, however both situations I think elicits different stimuli. The loss of a love one in the midst of a important goal I believe acts as a catalyst for an individual to work harder than the previously worked prior to the time of the occurrence. If that individual meant a lot to you, you'll be inspired to do everything you could possibly do in order to honor their memory.
Think Buster Douglas weeks before his fight with Tyson. For the first time in his life, Douglass who had in the past given up to lesser opponents found a reason to stand for something. His desire to honor the memory of his mother triumphed any danger that Tyson possessed to him in Tokyo. With Jordan during that series, I believe his mental state at that period was similar to Buster Douglass in Tokyo.

Now compare that to finding out that a teammate of yours is banging your mom. To me that's akin to finding out a teammate is banging your wife.
I'll throw you this question. If you were a ball player and you found out that a teammate of yours was banging your mom, would you be inspired to go out there and give it your best or do you think you'll find yourself in a state of shock, confusion and distress.
What Delonte West did was a violation of MAN CODE. I don't care who you are, that shit will have you acting irrationally. A teammates sister maybe. A parent or spouse is a NO NO. That was some foul ass shit that Delonte west did.