So why can't the sanctioning bodies use proper rankings?

Jul 23, 2013
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Something which has annoyed me a lot recently is the absolute shower of shite that is the 4 main orgs top 15 rankings. Crap rankings lead to crap mandatories and force titlists to choose from a crap poole of fighters for crap voluntaries.

I feel like if one of the bodies decided to use a ranking system purely based on who the best 15 fighters in the world are (such as the great fan rankings on this site), they could really get a jump on their competition and take themselves closer to being a 'singular' title. Their mandatories would be infinitely better. Their champions would be able to choose from a much better poole of fighters. The hardcore fanbase would have a title they could actually get behind (and I think eventually casuals would too. Us fans do a lot of educating of casual fans on a daily basis).

So what is the reasoning for the ranking system they use? Sometimes you feel like money is the factor, but other times you get fighters who have no big time backing shooting up the rankings after fighting nobodies. Where is the logic?
 
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Jul 23, 2013
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At HW,

WBA:
AUGUST - 2016
Published:
Sep-15-2016


1 LUIS ORTIZ INTERIM CHAMP CUB
2 WLADIMIR KLITSCHKO UKR
3 ALEXANDER USTINOV RUS
4 FRES OQUENDO PUR
5 LUCAS BROWNE AUS
6 DAVID HAYE GBR
7 MANUEL CHARR GER
8 SHANNON BRIGGS USA
9 JOSEPH PARKER NZL
10 JARRELL MILLER USA
11 TREVOR BRYAN USA
12 KUBRAT PULEV BUL
13 ANDREY FEDOSOV RUS
14 GUILLERMO JONES LAC PAN
15 JUN LONG ZHANG OCEANIA CHN

WBO:
1 Joseph Parker (Oriental) NZ
2 Wladimir Klitschko (Sup. Champion) UKR
3 Andy Ruiz USA
4 David Haye UK
5 Hughie Fury (Int-Cont.) UK
6 Jarell Miller (NABO) USA
7 Michael Wallisch (WBO Europe) GER
8 Edmund Gerber KAZ
9 Tom Schwarz (WBO Youth) GER
10 Kubrat Pulev BUL
11 David Price UK
12 Izuagbe Ugonoh (WBO Africa) NIG
13 Andrey Fedosov USA
14 Erkan Teper GER
15 Andrzej Wawrzyk POL

WBC:
1 .- Alexander Povetkin (Russia)
2 .- Bermane Stiverne (Haiti/Canada)
3 .- Kubrat Pulev (Bulgaria) EBU
4 .- Joseph Parker (New Zealand) OPBF
5 .- Johann Duhaupas (France) SILVER
6 .- Andy Ruiz (Mexico) NABF
7 .- Bryant Jennings (US)
8 .- Eric Molina (US)
9 .- Artur Szpilka (Poland)
10 .- Gerald Washington (US)
11 .- Carlos Takam (Cameroon)
12 .- Mariusz Wach (Poland)
13 .- Dillian Whyte (Jamaica/GB) INTL/BBB C
14 .- Dereck Chisora (GB) * CBP/BBB of C
15 .- Jarrell Miller (US) * CBP/P

IBF:
1 Joseph Parker New Zealand
2 Kubrat Pulev Bulgaria
3 David Haye United Kingdom
4 Johan Duhaupas France
5 Andy Ruiz Mexico
6 Carlos Takam France
7 Vyacheslav Glazkov Ukraine
8 Eric Molina United States
9 Jarrell Miller United States
10 Derek Chisora Zimbabwe
11 Charles Martin United States
12 David Price England
13 Izuagbe Ugonoh Poland
14 Hugie Fury England
15 Erkan Teper Germany

I mean fucking hell. David Haye is ranked #6, #4 and #3 and he hasnt fought anyone even half decent since 2012 :lol:
 
Oct 27, 2016
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Money aint it. They basically sell their rankings.
Yes promoters working with a preferred organization also the staging title fights be it champion or challenger and that organization getting a sanctioning fee.Low and behold relationships develop the promoter finds it easier to get their own fighters ranked highly when they often have faced no one of note.
 
Jun 2, 2012
20,884
5,305
Team Fury
Some of the guys on their rankings dont even bring money though.
Also think about how many shit IBF champions there are, because the good fighters can't/won't deal with the constantly enforced mandatories. So although the IBF is trying to do a good thing the big money fighters just won't play ball.
 

Bajingo

Staff member
May 31, 2012
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Because when actual good fights are ordered by sanctioning bodies the fighters complain about the splits or having to possibly work with a promoter they don't like and end up pulling out.
 
R

Rob

Guest
The rankings are more based on influence and talent and record. Simple as that really.

Who goes to Oxford & Cambridge the 5,000 smartest 18 year olds every year? It's how the world works.
 
Dec 29, 2014
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So the governing bodies can do European/Asian/Pacific/African/Inter-Continental/Silver/International/Latin/Oriental belts, plus a rankings spot, in exchange for a sanctioning fee.

Also if certain promoters work with them more than other bodies, they will treat them favourably. Just business (Sadly.)

Take for example the WBO International Heavyweight title which Hughie Fury was going to fight Andy Ruiz for before he pulled out. Spot the trend..

http://boxrec.com/title/WBOINTN?division=Heavyweight
 
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Jul 23, 2013
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Because when actual good fights are ordered by sanctioning bodies the fighters complain about the splits or having to possibly work with a promoter they don't like and end up pulling out.
I guess they have reached the stage now where their brand is so devalued they cant demand fights or pressure top fighters anymore.

They could do with a much more vocal media presence along with good rankings to call out fighters if they are avoiding fights that are ordered.

I really dont think it would take long for fans to cotton on to a sanctioning body who was trying to do the right thing. And once they have the fans ear it would be much easier for them to order tough fights between top fighters
 
Jul 23, 2013
3,671
3,431
The rankings are more based on influence and talent and record. Simple as that really.

Who goes to Oxford & Cambridge the 5,000 smartest 18 year olds every year? It's how the world works.
True but most companies and organisations have at least a basic long term plan and idea of a bigger picture. They wouldnt sacrifice their brand for a quick buck for example. Or if they did they wouldnt do it as often as these orgs in boxing do

I feel like at the moment its just short term thinking and short term profit making which is stopping these orgs from sorting their shit out.

They are like a girl who hops in to bed with anyone who gives her the eyes, and then is confused why men treat her like shit. These orgs have no self respect and so in turn fighters, promoters and fans give them no respect back.
 
Sep 1, 2016
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The belts have become so devalued because of the behaviour of the individual organisations that the belts are worth very little now.

Does Canelo necessarily need a belt on the line if he fights? I don't think so, as long as the fight is well received that's all that matters.

I can't remember what belts Floyd fought for in the latter part of his career. It basically didn't matter.

When boxers like Quigg are basically given a belt, Burns too at 140 you question their worth.

It won't change either, it simply can't. Money is all that matters to these organisations. They don't give a fuck about boxing as a whole.
 
R

Rob

Guest
True but most companies and organisations have at least a basic long term plan and idea of a bigger picture. They wouldnt sacrifice their brand for a quick buck for example. Or if they did they wouldnt do it as often as these orgs in boxing do

I feel like at the moment its just short term thinking and short term profit making which is stopping these orgs from sorting their shit out.

They are like a girl who hops in to bed with anyone who gives her the eyes, and then is confused why men treat her like shit. These orgs have no self respect and so in turn fighters, promoters and fans give them no respect back.
These belts have been around for decades. They are planning long term.
 
Jul 23, 2013
3,671
3,431
These belts have been around for decades. They are planning long term.
They are planning badly then because they have allowed their influence to drop to historic lows while also having their brand image crash through the floor. They have never been closer to complete irrelevance than they are now.
 
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One to watch

CHB WORLD CHAMPION 2018
Jun 5, 2013
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Liam smiths choice of top 15 recently (before Canelo when they got radosevic) was the worst set of rankings Id ever seen.and the WBO have a good set of champions as well.shocking list.
 
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beadybea

Twitter @beadybea
Jul 6, 2012
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Does anyone have an estimate on what the governing bodies are worth or how much money they make? ie is the dream of some billionaire buying them all out feasible?
 

Claypole

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Jun 4, 2013
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So, having a title, like AJ, and Wilder means you don't get ranked by the other bodies?

Also, I wonder how many people of all those names have fought each other? Rankings should really be about who's better than who, instead they seem to be mainly about how good the might possibly be, based on how well they beat modest opposition.

How do the likes of Edmund Gerber and David Price get on an of those lists, though? Maybe they should fight each other, at the very least?
 
Jun 14, 2012
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What I really hate about the four main organizations is that a belt holder could realistically stay in their own little bubble. Say Joseph Parker wins the WBO. He effectively wouldn't ever have to fight Wilder Joshua or Ortiz. Like over in Germany they seem to be in their own little world for the most part. The WBA regular titles are worth next to fuck all in most cases bbut still fellas like Braehmer defended for ages against the divisions also rans. Abraham made something like 10 defences of the IBF at middleweight and only really fought a proper dangerous opponent in Miranda at the time. His WBO title run at 168 was played very safe as well until he fought Ramirez.
 

Oli

Jun 6, 2013
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To me only the WBC belt is worth a toss these days. The others completely worthless and mean absolutely nothing.

In fact the others should be de-recognised. The WBA in particular is worth less than one of those toy belts you could get in Wilkinsons when you were about 9.