UK Politics: General Election - December 12th 2019

General Election 2019: Who would you vote for?


  • Total voters
    63
  • Poll closed .
May 8, 2013
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Did you know most US milk is UHT treated? That milk you buy in the chilled aisle at your grocers is actually the same crap sold on the non chilled section, US producers started doing this when UHT milk wasn't selling so they repackaged it and stuck it in the chilled aisle to fool consumers into thinking it was normally pasteurised milk.
This is incorrect. At the supermarket where I shop, the vast majority is pasteurized via normal HTST process which gives a shelf life, when refrigerated, of 2 to 3 weeks. I have many options available - from organic milk from grass-fed cows that receive no hormone or antibiotics, to raw milk (never saw the "why" there, the shit goes bad in a few days), to "normal" milk from large dairy farms that use HTST pasteurization (many of these advertise as "hormone free, though not grass-fed), to UHT milk that can be stored without refrigeration for things like camping, etc.

You guys over there have a weird view of US food. All US food suppliers conform to cGMP requirements, which means that processes are researched and adjusted to continually drive impurities down. cGMP is also used in the pharmaceutical industry.

Not sure where your propaganda about US food comes from, but it is inaccurate. We have a far greater variety to choose from, it seems. Makes sense, as our production is far greater, and the sources of that production are more numerous. You can get the premium grade antibiotic & hormone free meats, milks, etc. - as long as you are willing to pay a little more.

I do. And more & more US consumers are doing the same. One of these days I am going to take a photo or two of the meat case in my local supermarket so you can see for yourselves that you are speaking of things that do not exist in today's America. There has been a push to limit antibiotics and hormones in foods over here for well over a decade. I just laugh at the propaganda I see.
 
May 8, 2013
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US food standards ARE categorically lower. It's why eggs have to be in fridges in the US, because compulsory salmonella vaccines for egg laying hens is not in place like it is in Europe. Companies like Smithfield produce pork in the most horrific conditions, pollute horrendously and get away with it over and over. Numerous additives that are banned in Europe are allowed in US products.

You can get top level food in the US, but there is a ton of dreadful food with much lower standards. Shit, I can't even find free range chicken in Whole Foods when I am in the US. Using hormones in meat production is illegal here, in the US the most expensive meat in places like Whole Foods has labels bragging that it's "hormone free" because most of the meat available is produced from animals pumped with growth hormones.
Go to Vons / Pavilions (owned by Safeway). You can find free range chicken, and even eggs laid by free range chickens, every day of the week. I know, as I buy it. Same for antibiotic and hormone free beef, pork, and chicken.

:lol:
 
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May 8, 2013
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So no raw cheeses
Wrong. Cheeses made from raw milk simply must be aged prior to sale, so they can be tested for bacterial growth. It is actually a safety thing. But US food is more dangerous and nasty, right?

Unpasteurized cheese is sold in shops all around the world. In the United States, however, laws regulate the sales of cheese made from unpasteurized milk. In the USA, raw-milk cheese can only be sold after it has aged for at least 60 days
And there are exemptions go certain producers, such as in Amish country. Not sure what that is about.
 

Ronsonfly

Toxic White Male
May 8, 2013
8,798
12,325
In a deplorable basket
Wrong. Cheeses made from raw milk simply must be aged prior to sale, so they can be tested for bacterial growth. It is actually a safety thing. But US food is more dangerous and nasty, right?



And there are exemptions go certain producers, such as in Amish country. Not sure what that is about.
Don't know what everyone is getting so cuntysalty about with the American food thing.

If it was that bad Americans would be dying earlier than the skinnies in Africa and the streetshitters in the sub-continent but they aren't. They are all fat cunts living forever whilst wheeling around on motobility blubberscooters. :rofl I've been looking at trying to insult a few more regions and nationalities in this but will just have to settle for blowing e-snot rockets at the eurotrash for being dregs.
 
Reactions: Major Pain

Jack

P4P Star
Jul 29, 2012
9,522
4,087
Not sure where your propaganda about US food comes from, but it is inaccurate. We have a far greater variety to choose from, it seems. Makes sense, as our production is far greater, and the sources of that production are more numerous. You can get the premium grade antibiotic & hormone free meats, milks, etc. - as long as you are willing to pay a little more.
It largely stems from the recent fearmongering by the left about trade deals with America after leaving Europe. They wanted us to remain in Europe, so spread misinformation and fear about what could possibly be imported in higher numbers after Brexit, so that's why Corbyn talked about things like chlorinated chicken as some bizarre, highly toxic addition even though these processes are commonly found in British supermarkets when buying other items, such as salad bags. It's just fearmongering from the left.

A lot of American food is shite but America has massive amounts of diversity in it's products, so only looking at the shit - which Europe also has - is overly negative. The quality of something like beef in this country isn't great and if every supermarket was importing USDA Prime, we'd be better off for it. We just need to ensure that we, as consumers, demand the high quality items rather than the cheap stuff, which most Americans don't want either, just like you wouldn't be clamouring for our cheap products.
 
May 8, 2013
8,928
3,888
US food standards ARE categorically lower. It's why eggs have to be in fridges in the US, because compulsory salmonella vaccines for egg laying hens is not in place like it is in Europe. Companies like Smithfield produce pork in the most horrific conditions, pollute horrendously and get away with it over and over. Numerous additives that are banned in Europe are allowed in US products.

You can get top level food in the US, but there is a ton of dreadful food with much lower standards. Shit, I can't even find free range chicken in Whole Foods when I am in the US. Using hormones in meat production is illegal here, in the US the most expensive meat in places like Whole Foods has labels bragging that it's "hormone free" because most of the meat available is produced from animals pumped with growth hormones.
EU organic compared to US organic:

EU organic standards do not require that the feed given to animals is organically grown or free from pesticides. So animals may be fed non-organic grains and graze on pasture sprayed with synthetic pesticides. Also, there is no defined limit to the amount of non-organic feed that can be given to animals whose end products will be labeled “organic”.

Organic regulations in the US require that all animal feed be certified organic in order to label dairy and meat as “organic”.

Chocolate, I'll give you. But of course in every US supermarket we have a section dedicated to Swiss, German, and UK chocolates, so they are available. They just cost more. I generally don't eat much chocolate, but if I do, it is Swiss. They are clearly better than German, UK, or US.
 
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May 8, 2013
8,928
3,888
It largely stems from the recent fearmongering by the left about trade deals with America after leaving Europe. They wanted us to remain in Europe, so spread misinformation and fear about what could possibly be imported in higher numbers after Brexit, so that's why Corbyn talked about things like chlorinated chicken as some bizarre, highly toxic addition even though these processes are commonly found in British supermarkets when buying other items, such as salad bags. It's just fearmongering from the left.

A lot of American food is shite but America has massive amounts of diversity in it's products, so only looking at the shit - which Europe also has - is overly negative. The quality of something like beef in this country isn't great and if every supermarket was importing USDA Prime, we'd be better off for it. We just need to ensure that we, as consumers, demand the high quality items rather than the cheap stuff, which most Americans don't want either, just like you wouldn't be clamouring for our cheap products.
This is fair. There are low-quality foods sold here - but nobody I know will buy them. Most of that shit goes to places that grind it up and add it to canned foods where you can't tell what you are eating. The actual cuts of meat made from the low quality producers that are sold as "steaks" and such generally are sold in low-end stores in poor areas. To be fair, most of the people in those areas cannot afford 20 USD for a pound of approved real steak.

Kind of like sausages the world around.
 
Reactions: Ronsonfly
Jun 4, 2012
28,675
19,409
Wrong. Cheeses made from raw milk simply must be aged prior to sale, so they can be tested for bacterial growth. It is actually a safety thing. But US food is more dangerous and nasty right?
Not all of it no, the high end stuff is as good as anywhere, but you have to hunt it out, and general packet stuff like cereal and snacks are even worse for you than they are by definition of not being very healthy.

And like I said, hormone free is something to advertise because it's so wide spread.
 
May 8, 2013
8,928
3,888
Not all of it no, the high end stuff is as good as anywhere, but you have to hunt it out, and general packet stuff like cereal and snacks are even worse for you than they are by definition of not being very healthy.

And like I said, hormone free is something to advertise because it's so wide spread.
One of the places I like to get my beef at is a bit of a drive, about 15 miles, so I only go there when I want something really good. It is an old family-owned butcher shop. They have USDA Prime beef (the highest grade, I think something like 4% of beef qualifies based on how much marbling, age of animal at time of butchering, and some other things I do not remember) in a variety of stages (wet aged for 21 - 28 days, dry aged for 45 - 60 days, or fresh if that is what you like). Of course the price per pound goes up (dry aged the most expensive since about one-third of the pre-aging weight is lost to the aging process), but you can get some really awesome steaks there. A couple of dry-aged filets set you back some pretty serious cash, but that stuff just about melts in your mouth and has a really nice intense beef and almost nutty flavor. A place like that only sells hormone and antibiotic free beef, of course, but there are corn fed and grass fed varieties. I personally like the grass fed Angus beef (which costs a bit more than corn fed). A couple of 8 ounce filets will run you about 60 bucks or so (the price fluctuates) but you can cook a steak at home that is every bit as good as ones I have had at places like Mortons, where you pay at least 100 bucks per dinner - a 6 oz steak with a few veggies and a potato.

For Supermarket meat, the higher end stores usually have USDA Choice, and that is pretty damn good if you get the right cuts. They will have a few cuts of Prime, but it sells out fast so you have the get there when they are stocking the case (or know the store's butcher). I don't think I have ever bought anything lower than Choice. But I am sure in the poorer areas they have USDA Select. The two lowest grades, Cutter and Canner, are generally not sold as retail cuts. They go into processed food.
 
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May 8, 2013
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Great page. Totally eye opening. I'd been led to believe that all US food was basically poison.
I think that if you really look into the subject, you will find that there has been a bit of hyperbole coming from the EU, which is probably being protectionist. I don't shop at low-end stores in nasty areas, so I get decent food, though I am probably paying a bit more than they are at the low-end shops & stores. In any case, we are not a third-world country, FFS, and we are not eating highly contaminated food like some of the stories seem to suggest. That UK food inspector I posted above in this thread put that idea to bed for me. His conclusion was that our food purities are actually quite similar.
 
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Jun 4, 2012
28,675
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One of the places I like to get my beef at is a bit of a drive, about 15 miles, so I only go there when I want something really good. It is an old family-owned butcher shop. They have USDA Prime beef (the highest grade, I think something like 4% of beef qualifies based on how much marbling, age of animal at time of butchering, and some other things I do not remember) in a variety of stages (wet aged for 21 - 28 days, dry aged for 45 - 60 days, or fresh if that is what you like). Of course the price per pound goes up (dry aged the most expensive since about one-third of the pre-aging weight is lost to the aging process), but you can get some really awesome steaks there. A couple of dry-aged filets set you back some pretty serious cash, but that stuff just about melts in your mouth and has a really nice intense beef and almost nutty flavor. A place like that only sells hormone and antibiotic free beef, of course, but there are corn fed and grass fed varieties. I personally like the grass fed Angus beef (which costs a bit more than corn fed). A couple of 8 ounce filets will run you about 60 bucks or so (the price fluctuates) but you can cook a steak at home that is every bit as good as ones I have had at places like Mortons, where you pay at least 100 bucks per dinner - a 6 oz steak with a few veggies and a potato.

For Supermarket meat, the higher end stores usually have USDA Choice, and that is pretty damn good if you get the right cuts. They will have a few cuts of Prime, but it sells out fast so you have the get there when they are stocking the case (or know the store's butcher). I don't think I have ever bought anything lower than Choice. But I am sure in the poorer areas they have USDA Select. The two lowest grades, Cutter and Canner, are generally not sold as retail cuts. They go into processed food.
Yeah, I am more than happy with USDA and the place you go to sounds brilliant. My concern about living in the US is just whether I'd have somewhere near me like that, or having to make an effort to ensure I could get free range meat etc. I know that in LA, NYC it is probably pretty easy, but chances are I would be in Philly (if we move) and while I liked the city and had plenty of decent food, I've never gone shopping there and lots of the time that I have gone shopping in the US I have struggled to find much in the way of free range etc.

Ironically, it would probably be very easy in the middle of nowhere in a rural community with lots of farms, but I wouldn't want to live far from a major city regardless of whether I was in the US, UK or back in Asia.
 
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May 8, 2013
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Yeah, I am more than happy with USDA and the place you go to sounds brilliant. My concern about living in the US is just whether I'd have somewhere near me like that, or having to make an effort to ensure I could get free range meat etc. I know that in LA, NYC it is probably pretty easy, but chances are I would be in Philly (if we move) and while I liked the city and had plenty of decent food, I've never gone shopping there and lots of the time that I have gone shopping in the US I have struggled to find much in the way of free range etc.

Ironically, it would probably be very easy in the middle of nowhere in a rural community with lots of farms, but I wouldn't want to live far from a major city regardless of whether I was in the US, UK or back in Asia.
Go to the stores in the wealthier suburbs, or to specialty meat shops in the city. Philly is a large enough city that you should be able to find whatever you want.

It is a bit of a hassle, but better than eating the crap that the lower-end supermarkets sell or the vile things that come out of a can.