ken buchanan
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Not sure
I saw him getting underrated on ESB by a lot of people who said he wasn't a great fighter. I think it's obvious simply from the footage that he was at least great in head to head terms. I love watching him.
I haven't seen much overrating of him but if I do I would be the first to say
I saw him getting underrated on ESB by a lot of people who said he wasn't a great fighter. I think it's obvious simply from the footage that he was at least great in head to head terms. I love watching him.
I haven't seen much overrating of him but if I do I would be the first to say
Top ten British boxer imo which makes him pretty great in my eyes. His resume is solid. He beat a very good British level boxer in Maurice Cullen for the title, beat an excellent world level boxer in Laguna to win the title and proving it was no fluke in the rematch. Hung with Duran for 13 rounds but was second best throughout, could have gone the distance if not for the sock shot but the result was always going to be a w for El Cholo, no shame there.
Battered Carlos Ortiz into surrendering on his stool and had a classic all Scotland encounter, coming out on top over Jim Watt. Other solid wins over Ruben Navaro, Carlos Hernandez, Chang kil-Lee but loses to other top boxers in Guts Ishimatsu and Miguel Velasquez. He was pretty much shot after Ishimatsu so no need to look any deeper after that.
That's a pretty damn good record in my eyes and when you watch him box he looks excellent. It all depends on who is rating him really, I would say he's a solid world champion and contender for a number of years in a very tough era of boxing, he won titles at domestic, continental and world level and has wins over two hall of famers. His peak losses all came to very good boxers, one a legendary boxer. Sure he's never going to be up their in the elite class of legends but he isn't out f place in the batch of guys who come after them.
Battered Carlos Ortiz into surrendering on his stool and had a classic all Scotland encounter, coming out on top over Jim Watt. Other solid wins over Ruben Navaro, Carlos Hernandez, Chang kil-Lee but loses to other top boxers in Guts Ishimatsu and Miguel Velasquez. He was pretty much shot after Ishimatsu so no need to look any deeper after that.
That's a pretty damn good record in my eyes and when you watch him box he looks excellent. It all depends on who is rating him really, I would say he's a solid world champion and contender for a number of years in a very tough era of boxing, he won titles at domestic, continental and world level and has wins over two hall of famers. His peak losses all came to very good boxers, one a legendary boxer. Sure he's never going to be up their in the elite class of legends but he isn't out f place in the batch of guys who come after them.
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agreed amongst brit lightweights I can think of only one better I think. would he make all time top 10 british boxers probably , but on world level I agree certainly a level below the top fighters .Ortiz looked old real old in the buchanan fight
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the only problem I have is with the Carlos Ortiz comment, I think it should be mentioned that he was a complete and utter shadow of his former self in that fight
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0:00-3:00
Buchanan to me is the definition of culture in one hand. He's got more variety in the jab than any other fighter i've ever seen. I don't know what that's worth and I don't want to get into all that now. But to me he has a left hand as special as any between Robinson and Marquez.
This is Buchanan's magical ninth against Duran. I think it's incredible that we're even looking at this fight because Buchanan's opponent is great in the way that no other opponent in this thread is, and Duran happens to have a serious style advantage and goods very specific to making it difficult for a left hand. But it's just about the best round he ever boxed.
Buchanan doesn't get going until about 20 seconds, and when he does it's with the jab to the chest. The jab to the chest is a bit of a no-man's land punch because it's hard to keep the throwing it safe from harm, but Buchanan jab's so definitely that he needs the extra culture for interference. Not that the hook that he throws right behind the jab is not disguised like the Canto hook, and that Duran picks it off a bit. So Ken gets back to the jab. After landing one each up and down, Buchanan becomes a little crowded on about 0:32 and he fires out a rat-a-tat-tat type jab, punches in quick succession designed to exact the maximum toll from a rushing opponent. Buchanan's problem is much more serious than Oscar's, he isn't able to dictate range and so he has to adapt.
At 1:00 he jabs up and down again and it's really working for him this round, keeping Duran off balance. 1:14 it's a weird looking "up" jab from a square stance as he's going away, taking Duran by surprise. He attacks on 1:23, trebbling the jab up beautifully. All three of those jabs are sent to different homes although they have the same general target, lovely variety. More variety with the jab as at 1:34 he steps all the way in with a hard jab to the body, by now a disguised punch for him. A testimony to the rhthym of its very own each round seems to have in some great fights. At 1:45 Buchanan throws one of his very definite down jabs and follows it up with a shorter left to the chest, an old old punch we tend not to see so much these days. The variety on the jab in this round is off the charts, and this is against a guy it is really hard to jab. Nailing Duran again with his rapido version of the punch at 2:06 Buchanan throws in a down jab and is chased to the ropes where he lands an absolutley beautiful counter left, mostly a sneaky hook rather reminiscent of Oscar's slap on Chavez.
Buchanan completes his set landing a smothered uppercut on 2:31 before jabbing and hooking his way to the bell. Watched in isolation it's hard to believe Buchanan lost this fight after this ninth round. He looks to be flat out out-boxing Duran, mostly one-handed.
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Ortiz was totally done but Ken did the job nonetheless.
Anyway, for me Buchanan's chin was first rate, as was his ability to grit his teeth and get stuck in.
His jab was first rate, superb, constant, varied and accurate.
His defence, mainly his upper body movement and ability to turn his man, is something I've always admired from an aesthetic point of view.
Nails, multi-talented boxer. Like compatriot Walter McGowan he may have relied on his chin and fighting spirit a bit too much rather than focusing on safely navigating his opponents, but that's not a negative.
I agree he's one of Britain's ten best.
Where do we rank him in comparison to Lynch? Higher, or lower?
Anyway, for me Buchanan's chin was first rate, as was his ability to grit his teeth and get stuck in.
His jab was first rate, superb, constant, varied and accurate.
His defence, mainly his upper body movement and ability to turn his man, is something I've always admired from an aesthetic point of view.
Nails, multi-talented boxer. Like compatriot Walter McGowan he may have relied on his chin and fighting spirit a bit too much rather than focusing on safely navigating his opponents, but that's not a negative.
I agree he's one of Britain's ten best.
Where do we rank him in comparison to Lynch? Higher, or lower?
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Alas, no cultured left hand conversation is complete without mentioning John Conteh.
I find it hard to rank Lynch, mainly because I've never really got round to reading up on him, I don't think I've even watched anything on him at all tbh.
Having a glance through his record and nothing really stands out for me so I'm guessing he's one of those guys like Wilde where you get a better insight when you study him.
So I'd have Buchanan ahead of him for now.
Having a glance through his record and nothing really stands out for me so I'm guessing he's one of those guys like Wilde where you get a better insight when you study him.
So I'd have Buchanan ahead of him for now.
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@chatty Unified Flyweight World title for first time in years. Wins over Kane (who was undefeated and something like 50-0(43) or summat like that) Small Montana (who was very good indeed and known for series with Midget Wolgast) Pat Palmer, Jackie Brown, Jackie Jurich (though Lynch was overweight he was past his best as well) although Warnock, World class, was his bogeyman it seems.
Once you watch him and realise what an incredible fighting force he was it all falls into place. Arguably the greatest fly of all time IMO, if not then surely one of the best H2H, a monster with a deceptively low K.O% and an iron chin.
http://www.aparchive.com/metadata/P...lFilters=&productType=IncludedProducts&page=1
Once you watch him and realise what an incredible fighting force he was it all falls into place. Arguably the greatest fly of all time IMO, if not then surely one of the best H2H, a monster with a deceptively low K.O% and an iron chin.
http://www.aparchive.com/metadata/P...lFilters=&productType=IncludedProducts&page=1
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I've read that the Velazquez fight was a robbery too. There used to be some articles in the Google Archives that I can't find anymore; and I think at least one of them mentioned something about Buchanan having either flu or a cold, which caused him to flag uncharacteristically down the stretch. The ref, Piero Brambilla I think, was supposedly bad too iirc, basically impeding Buchanan in everything he did while letting Velazquez get away with some skullduggery. He was the only judge too, and Spain was renowned at the time for bad decisions going against away fighters. On the other hand, My dinner with Conteh over on ESB once said something about it being a close decision that has retrospectively become a 'robbery', though I don't think he gave any evidence to prove it.
It's a hard fight to get info on. Buchanan was being moved very slowly outside of the main circles by Thomas and had received very little attention from the mainstream sports press at the time.
On a slightly different note, I thought Buchanan beat Ishimatsu by about 3 rounds, though he looked a shadow of himself by that point. He damaged his left eye badly in sparring and could barely see out of it, which led to Ishimatsu scoring a lot of heavy straights that closed it up and damaged it further. Still, I had him quite a way in front going into the last 3 rounds, but he looked knackered and practically blind by that point, and Ishimatsu knocked him about quite alarmingly to sweep those rounds and narrow the gap. He was normally a tank too, in the championship rounds earlier in his career.
His career took long to kickstart than it ought to have, and his time at the top was, for more than one reason, relatively short. Shorter than it should have been. Nonetheless, I'd class him as a great fighter. His record is underrated in my book and he was a unique stylist.
It's a hard fight to get info on. Buchanan was being moved very slowly outside of the main circles by Thomas and had received very little attention from the mainstream sports press at the time.
On a slightly different note, I thought Buchanan beat Ishimatsu by about 3 rounds, though he looked a shadow of himself by that point. He damaged his left eye badly in sparring and could barely see out of it, which led to Ishimatsu scoring a lot of heavy straights that closed it up and damaged it further. Still, I had him quite a way in front going into the last 3 rounds, but he looked knackered and practically blind by that point, and Ishimatsu knocked him about quite alarmingly to sweep those rounds and narrow the gap. He was normally a tank too, in the championship rounds earlier in his career.
His career took long to kickstart than it ought to have, and his time at the top was, for more than one reason, relatively short. Shorter than it should have been. Nonetheless, I'd class him as a great fighter. His record is underrated in my book and he was a unique stylist.
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Buchanan was class, one of my favorite fighters of all time. He was in there with some men, beating the majority of 'em. Laguna, Ortiz, Ford, Lee, Otero, etc. All lost to Ken. Whilst I concede some were past it, most notably Carlos Ortiz who was absolutely finished when he was stopped by Buchanan, he still racked up a quality resume. One of the UK's best boxers for sure.
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Ive got to agree that he's fairly overrated, at least by his record, which is good but you can pick a few holes in it, as some posters have alluded to. He's probably the best boxer to have come out of Scotland though, and ive always found him a joy to watch. Really good technical fighter, with an excellent jab, plus plenty of heart and toughness.
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To be fair to Ken, you can pick holes in any fighter's resume. :conf
He ain't no Ricky Burns, though.:hey
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