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Mark's Statement to Steve Bunce

5K views 55 replies 23 participants last post by  Wallet 
#1 ·
Last night there was a bit of an exchange of words on Twitter between our friend Mark (The Kebab house owner) and Steve Bunce, culminating in this. What's your opinion on the place of illegal streams in Boxing?

Statement for Steve Bunce

Since it's quite clear you won't have me on your show, i thought i would clear up a few points on your ignorant ramblings on Twitter.

Long before Boxnation, Primetime, Premiersports etc.. came along, these foreign fights was never covered by UK TV, bar Sky who picked the odd fight up,
people could legally NOT view a Sport they loved, so the idea of my site was made for that simple reason. People from abroad can view UK fights, and
people from UK can view American fights and other Europe countries/fights.
It really is that simple, the TV restrictions worldwide mean to follow Boxing you have to view streams online as certain fights do not have coverage abroad.

This is the ignorance that exists in you, cause you work on the premise that 800 viewers watching a fight card online, are 800 paying customers from the UK. That is not true, it is a fact
that many reporters from many Boxing sites, from America and other sites weekly use my site and others to watch domestic UK cards, because they have no other way to watch & report on such fights live.
It is also the same with foreign viewers who now have a way to access fights from the UK, this can only be good for the Sport.

This can only benefit the Sport, it is exactly how UFC grew to what it was, when it first started out UFC was illegal in large parts of Europe and only way to access the Sport
was via online, it is a fact it was online streams that grew UFC worldwide because withoutit people would not have had access to view the Sport and become a fan.

Only in Boxing does it restrict people having access to view the Sport, prime example was recent Matthysse vs Olusegun a fight Boxnation DROPPED from it's Schedule, a fight that was not able to be
accessed in the UK. So how did you watch the fight ? If you viewed it via Youtube, again video content uploaded that does not have the permission, so how exactly did you watch the fight ?

How do people from America view fights such as Brook and many other UK cards that feature on Sky & other Channels, you think my site has a negative affect on allowing people abroad who have no way
to access the fight to watch for free ? You don't think online streams have in anyway help grew Brooks name abroad who evidently his next fight is in America against a American fighter...

My site exist simply to promote, grow and keep Boxing viewable to everyone around the World, it does not exist to put any Channel, Boxing or Promoter out of Business.

People who can afford Boxing will pay for it, as a small bitrate feed online does not compare to HD on a TV, the majority of people watching online fall into several groups

1) People who can't afford it: If they can't afford it they simply can't afford it, it's that simple, removing free streams simply removes a fan from the Sport, if that person has viewed
Boxing online for free and lifes circumstances change then he/she may well pay for Boxing, but until then it's a fan of the Sport that keeps watching which aint a bad thing.

2) People abroad: As pointed out, alot of viewers are people who are abroad and can not access fights from certain countries, whether Boxing reporters or just a general viewer they're
as interest in Boxing around the world as anyone else, under your thinking they would be cut off from seeing UK fighters which is a good thing in your eyes im guessing.

Your tweets are embarrassing at best, cause it's just pure ignorance you don't see the bigger picture, the amount of people who buy tickets from watching fights for free, people who go on
to pay for subscriptions to channels from watching for free is big, sites like mine not only promote Fighters bt also the Channels.

If people can afford Boxing they should pay it, but your attitude that if one can't afford to pay, nor has no legal access to view they should simply miss out does more damage than good.
I ask again the fights not covered on UK TV over last few years how have you accessed these fights whether live or replayed via Youtube or other sites which morally/legally are just as
bad as my site in your eyes. So you're a hypocrite at best with a large slice of ignorance also.

Again in regards to saying i cost people money, the only real impact my site has on Boxing is PPV fights, whether a $70 fight in Americas this weekend for Marquez vs Pacqiuao or £15 via UK to watch a 4th fight
no doubt fixed, my sites give people a choice on events like this not to fund the pockets of people like Bob Arum, again the Haye vs Harrison fight, which was never PPV material people had a choice whether to pay for such
bullshit fights which are simply aimed at ripping off the mass public, again a fight that did more damage to Boxing than anything else in recent years.

I lose no sleep over people like Bob Arum and others who have ripped the Sport off for years and ruined it, if i in anyway thought i was affecting the smaller people in Boxing my site would be closed tomorrow(and then replaced by the 100 other sites that exist).
People have a choice not to accept bullshit PPV events, which inturn hopefully has a affect that promoters put on better cards to entice people to pay, but again the large number who watch the weekly average cards can't pay.

Many people in Boxing use my site, whether trainers, promoters, Boxing journalists & even Boxers themselves, only yourself & few others sees such sites as cancer to Boxing your stance would only make the Sport even more of a minority of a Sport.

I will touch on one last thing, if you feel so strongly about people being cost money in general, then maybe you should look at the person/people you work with, given recent high profile Tweets of several fighters i won't name, unless you are calling them liars, then how does it sit with you working with people like that who have allegedly according to these people are/was owed money?

I respect you for your opinion, and is alot more i could pick on including figures/stats which again make you comments even more ridiculous but i won't bore people, if you wish to have me on the show i'll happily go into detail, but ive made partly my view on all this so i will leave you to tweet nonsense on your soapbox whilst you work for people doing much more damage.
 
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#4 ·
I have boxnation as have lots of others here but without streams I'd have missed out on probable fight of the year rios-alvarado and the the recent matthysse fight also.
Buncey can complain all he like but as 'mark' said if his site is closed down hundreds more will pop up so he can't/won't win
 
#7 ·
I would like to point out, this kicked off as i politely asked him about his live Phone-In in which he decided to go off on one(when in past hes replied to many tweets fine) and call me a coward, no bollocks and a range of other insults. You can read all my tweets i was polite to him and said i would call the show and debate his comments which was simply put out to get a reaction. He then went on to abuse people who pulled him up on stuff.

I like the guy but hes been a complete tool on this issue.
 
#8 ·
Between Sky, Primetime, Boxnation, Premier Sports, ESPN and fuck knows what else it's fucking expensive these days if you want to watch all the boxing.

Sky: You're looking at £40 a month to get sky with sky sports.
Primetime: £15 this month for Pac-JMM
Boxnation: £10
Premier Sports: £10
ESPN: £10

That's £85 for December and you'll still likely be missing a load of stuff that's not shown by any of those. I doubt there's many people who follow boxing closely who don't use streams and illegal uploads these days.

And people wonder why there's not so many hardcore fans these days and that most fans are casuals who don't know shit about shit...
 
#9 ·
WAR Mark

Has Buncey replied and if so what was his response. I'm with Mark on this one, he is pretty much correct although he missed out the third section of people who use streams:

3) Those of whom don't want to line the pockets of promoters who do as much as they can to shaft paying fans via poor mis-match championship fights.
 
#11 ·
I take Mark's comments with a pinch of salt, although I agree with a lot of what he says. He is making money himself out of this as well as other sports, he just feels the need to justify what he does as if he's some kind of hero. The dude earns a tidy second living out of this.

I regularly use the site though and think it's great.
 
#13 ·
I take Mark's comments with a pinch of salt, although I agree with a lot of what he says. He is making money himself out of this as well as other sports, he just feels the need to justify what he does as if he's some kind of hero. The dude earns a tidy second living out of this.

I regularly use the site though and think it's great.
Incorrect slightly Bryn, my money i make is off nutjob, the boxing site is something i have to enjoy to do it, cause 95% of what i cover i make zero money, those ads on the player are not mine. Factor i pay nearly £60 a month for web hosting costs, on top of all the channels/fights i buy i operate at a loss most months.

I paid $60 so 400 people could watch Moises Fuentes vs Ivan Calderon & Wilfredo Vazquez Jr vs Jonathan Oquendo at 4am, of course big PPV fights i do well, but if i was simply to do what i do purely on a money making issue i would cover big fights only on nutjob. And those sort of fights are like 2/3 a year.
 
#14 ·
Incorrect slightly Bryn, my money i make is off nutjob, the boxing site is something i have to enjoy to do it, cause 95% of what i cover i make zero money, those ads on the player are not mine. Factor i pay nearly £60 a month for web hosting costs, on top of all the channels/fights i buy i operate at a loss most months.

I paid $60 so 400 people could watch Moises Fuentes vs Ivan Calderon & Wilfredo Vazquez Jr vs Jonathan Oquendo at 4am, of course big PPV fights i do well, but if i was simply to do what i do purely on a money making issue i would cover big fights only on nutjob. And those sort of fights are like 2/3 a year.
I get what you're saying mate, thanks for the explanation.
 
#15 ·
I think its one of those issues where the different sides are that fundamentally opposed that they are never going to agree. I'm far from whiter than white where streams are concerned but one thing i have no qualms about, and it happens a lot, is streaming a fight when there is no way of paying to watch it in the UK.
 
#17 · (Edited)
Ive never claimed to be any sort of hero, i like pissing off people like fish eyes bob arum and other dickheads in boxing, i enjoy boxing like rest of you guys and love to debate it have a laugh and odd troll(as ESB shown). if i was trying to be a hero id be letting everyone know who i am. as soon as my sites closed down/shutdown people move on, they remember a site, not the gimp who runs it, plus many people help out, from america and uk, how you think i get hbo/showtime coverage im not in the US so it's not me doing it.

Just a group of boxing fans who watch boxing, ive been offered many a time to turn my site into a pay site, ive said no. it's not about the money for me, when i stop enjoying boxing i stop showing it. that simple.

they can close it down, i'll get a social life back on weekends in the end so every cloud has a silver lining! :lol:
 
#18 ·
I was following the tweets last night.

I will always pay for boxing on TV (despite how often I bitch about it). I am a sky customer and subscribed to BoxNation the day it became operational. Hell, I still have Premier Sports!. Between the two channels, 95% of major events are covered, so I'm a happy customer. Financially, I understand not every card can be televised. But as a boxing journalist, I feel I have to watch Donaire - Nishioka and Rios - Alvarado live. I have to watch the best 140lb fighter in Matthysse, just like I have to watch Ricky Burns.

I moved to Australia a few years ago for about 6 months, and I woke up at 4am to watch Mitchell/Murray, Khan/ Judah, Fury/Chisora and Haye/Wlad (laggy as fuck, thanks Mark). While I wasn't writing at this time, as a fan, I had to watch these fights. It's that simple.

Is what Mark is doing right? Of course not. It's theft. But until I am able to watch all the boxing I want (Choi / Yordan for instance) I will continue to use him, and not feel the slightest bit bad.
 
#19 ·
Ive never claimed to be any sort of hero, i like pissing off people like fish eyes bob arum and other dickheads in boxing, i enjoy boxing like rest of you guys and love to debate it have a laugh and odd troll(as ESB shown). if i was trying to be a hero id be letting everyone know who i am. as soon as my sites closed down/shutdown people move on, they remember a site, not the gimp who runs it, plus many people help out, from america and uk, how you think i get hbo/showtime coverage im not in the US so it's not me doing it.

Just a group of boxing fans who watch boxing, ive been offered many a time to turn my site into a pay site, ive said no. it's not about the money for me, when i stop enjoying boxing i stop showing it. that simple.

they can close it down, i'll get a social life back on weekends in the end so every cloud has a silver lining! :lol:
Aren't you worried about the consequences if you get caught though? Can't you get a massive fine or jail time or something?

I use your site on a weekly basis, it's great being able to watch boxing I'd otherwise miss. If it wasn't for you and sites like sweetboxingvideos I simply wouldn't be able to watch it.
 
#20 ·
Aren't you worried about the consequences if you get caught though? Can't you get a massive fine or jail time or something?

I use your site on a weekly basis, it's great being able to watch boxing I'd otherwise miss. If it wasn't for you and sites like sweetboxingvideos I simply wouldn't be able to watch it.
Mark is a ninja. Man ain't getting caught. Unless him rings Bunce from his mobile and the Old Bill track it
 
#23 ·
Aren't you worried about the consequences if you get caught though? Can't you get a massive fine or jail time or something?

I use your site on a weekly basis, it's great being able to watch boxing I'd otherwise miss. If it wasn't for you and sites like sweetboxingvideos I simply wouldn't be able to watch it.
I aint got a pot to piss in so good luck on a massive fine. way i look on things is if i can sleep at night.

i don't rape kids or women, i don't rob pensioners, i don't deal drugs, i don't shoot people ive never been arrested in my life never took a drug and barely drink, if i deserve to be locked up with them people then so be it, i don't see what i do as a bad thing if others do then so be it.

the laws here compared to US are totally different, and rightly so imo.
 
#24 ·
Personally I still don't think online streaming like this should even be illegal anyway. Would it be illegal to invite half a dozen mates round to watch a big fight even if they didn't buy the pay per views themselves? Of course not. So apart from this being on a bigger scale, what's the difference? What if I invited a dozen mates round? Where's the line?

It's just a case of people being greedy again. The same with the billion pound movie and music industries complaining about "illegal" sharing.
 
#25 ·
Can somebody post a link to the tweets at all please?
Don't really know how to link on twitter but here's some screenshots:

http://gyazo.com/6dadb12b4b1c8732943460be4a14cde1
http://gyazo.com/bb8f09adee860460b6da6b2a5cad12f7
http://gyazo.com/7d7b527e5e100020564eb7291ec9ed0d
http://gyazo.com/d776aed2e35c33af1489abb59dec60eb

I aint got a pot to piss in so good luck on a massive fine. way i look on things is if i can sleep at night.

i don't rape kids or women, i don't rob pensioners, i don't deal drugs, i don't shoot people ive never been arrested in my life never took a drug and barely drink, if i deserve to be locked up with them people then so be it, i don't see what i do as a bad thing if others do then so be it.

the laws here compared to US are totally different, and rightly so imo.
You've clearly not lived.
 
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