Okay.my point is some attacked klompton for saying he doesn't believe Burt.
in my opinion there's a higher probability that klompton is correct than there is that burt is correct.
My Boxing Mystery only Sherlock Holmes MIGHT solve !!! Robinson/Bobby ***** ?
I have posted this before, but it deserves another shot onTHIS forum...This truly occured to me...
In the early 1950s, an event happened that will puzzle me forever...I, and a buddy now deceased saw Ray Robinson decision a very good WW contender
Bobby ***** at an outdoor Arena in Coney Island, B'klyn, NY...I remember vividly recalling at the event that Ray Robinson fought Bobby ***** ONCE
before in Chicago on TV in Nov, 1950...And Robby won a decision over the lanky Florida boxer Bobby *****...I remember so clearly that
Ray Robinson was late arriving at the match, and about 1 hour later I watched from the top of the outdoor Arena Robinson arriving with his entourage
in a Fuscia colored Cadilac , hustling into the dressing room late..This I saw from the top of the stands peering down...
The fight was uneventful, but the mystery is this fight I SAW has never been recorded in any record book or box.Rec, and try as I could, no record exists
of this bought I watched in the early 1950s...I know from the record books that I have and from some boxing historians, that Ray Robinson did beat a
Billy Brown on Sept 4, 1950, TWO months BEFORE Robinson beat Bobby ***** in their first fight on tv ,Nov 8, 1950...
The fight I saw I recall was years after Robby beat Bobby ***** in 1950...So my mystery has never been solved...An immortal like Robinson
fought a bout in Coney Island Arena against a major boxing figure like Bobby ***** who once whipped Kid Gavilan, which I certainly SAW and
there is no record of this bout...Both Robinson and Bobby ***** are both dead and they would have solved my puzzle were I able to contact them..
A mystery to me indeed...My Bermuda Triangle...
In the early 1950s, an event happened that will puzzle me forever...I, and a buddy now deceased saw Ray Robinson decision a very good WW contender
Bobby ***** at an outdoor Arena in Coney Island, B'klyn, NY...I remember vividly recalling at the event that Ray Robinson fought Bobby ***** ONCE
before in Chicago on TV in Nov, 1950...And Robby won a decision over the lanky Florida boxer Bobby *****...I remember so clearly that
Ray Robinson was late arriving at the match, and about 1 hour later I watched from the top of the outdoor Arena Robinson arriving with his entourage
in a Fuscia colored Cadilac , hustling into the dressing room late..This I saw from the top of the stands peering down...
The fight was uneventful, but the mystery is this fight I SAW has never been recorded in any record book or box.Rec, and try as I could, no record exists
of this bought I watched in the early 1950s...I know from the record books that I have and from some boxing historians, that Ray Robinson did beat a
Billy Brown on Sept 4, 1950, TWO months BEFORE Robinson beat Bobby ***** in their first fight on tv ,Nov 8, 1950...
The fight I saw I recall was years after Robby beat Bobby ***** in 1950...So my mystery has never been solved...An immortal like Robinson
fought a bout in Coney Island Arena against a major boxing figure like Bobby ***** who once whipped Kid Gavilan, which I certainly SAW and
there is no record of this bout...Both Robinson and Bobby ***** are both dead and they would have solved my puzzle were I able to contact them..
A mystery to me indeed...My Bermuda Triangle...
41 - 60 of 76 Posts
I've been far more wrong while previously every bit as certain about less confusing things which took place far more recently than Robinson-Brown and Robinson-*****. Figured the most productive thing I could do was work the Coney Island Velodrome history angle, then see if I could find any visual images of Billy Brown. When I spotted Randy Turpin on his record, and the timing of Brown's visit to the UK, I figured good ole British Pathe just might come through on this one, and wasn't disappointed.
I also think it is a case of mistaken memories.I've been far more wrong while previously every bit as certain about less confusing things which took place far more recently than Robinson-Brown and Robinson-*****. Figured the most productive thing I could do was work the Coney Island Velodrome history angle, then see if I could find any visual images of Billy Brown. When I spotted Randy Turpin on his record, and the timing of Brown's visit to the UK, I figured good ole British Pathe just might come through on this one, and wasn't disappointed.
I have my fair share of memories gone wrong. I was just talking in terms of which absolute seems the more plausible.
I remember vividly recalling at the event that Ray Robinson fought Bobby ***** ONCE
before in Chicago on TV in Nov, 1950...And Robby won a decision over the lanky Florida boxer Bobby *****...
I know from the record books that I have and from some boxing historians, that Ray Robinson did beat a
Billy Brown on Sept 4, 1950, TWO months BEFORE Robinson beat Bobby ***** in their first fight on tv ,Nov 8, 1950...
The fight I saw I recall was years after Robby beat Bobby ***** in 1950...
So my mystery has never been solved...An immortal like Robinson
fought a bout in Coney Island Arena against a major boxing figure like Bobby ***** who once whipped Kid Gavilan, which I certainly SAW and
there is no record of this bout...Both Robinson and Bobby ***** are both dead and they would have solved my puzzle were I able to contact them..
A mystery to me indeed...My Bermuda Triangle...
Damn! I remember this query, looking at the ESB thread I checked a bunch of places to no avail
I'm Bobby ***** grandson, if you're still looking for the answer, let me know and I'll see if someone in my family can figure it out for me.
Investigate Reveal the truthI'm Bobby ***** grandson, if you're still looking for the answer, let me know and I'll see if someone in my family can figure it out for me.
My Lord ,Bobby ****'s grandson...So happy to hear from you sir. I'm an oldtimer who saw your grandpa lose a close decision from theI'm Bobby ***** grandson, if you're still looking for the answer, let me know and I'll see if someone in my family can figure it out for me.
great Ray Robinson from Chicago ,on my 12"television set on Nov.8,1950...Your grandpa was a darn good welterweight for sure...Several years later in the
early 1950s I believe I and my buddy, now deceased went to a Coney Island boxing Arena in Brooklyn, NY, where I saw your granddad fight
Ray Robinson I recalled then, for the second time . Bobby ***** was introduced by the announcer I remember,and Robinson arrived almost 1 hour late, arriving in
his Fuscia colored Cadillac, with his entourage [which I saw from the last row of the outdoor Arena, peering down]. I recall vividly Robinson won a decision again in a very dull affair. Robinson was not champion at this fight I recall. Years later when I looked at my boxing record books, I was shocked to find
that there is no mention of the Ray Robinson / Bobby ***** in Bklyn, Ny in the 1950s...NONE.But I know I saw them fight ,and remember so well
to this day your tall granddad box Ray Robinson in Coney Island...I am glad that maybe you or your family from Tampa Florida I presume, can shed some light on
my true mystery...I know the bout was not billed as an exhibition, as I recall they had a full prelim card...Maybe it was a last minute match to fill a canceled boxing card, at the last minute...? At any rate I hope you can shed some light sir...Thank you!
I remember this from ESB as well. Remember searching for hours but finding absolutely nothing.
Hope you finally manage to solve it.
Hope you finally manage to solve it.
no one attacks him, your just not allowed to disagree with him, he's always right.my point is some attacked klompton for saying he doesn't believe Burt.
in my opinion there's a higher probability that klompton is correct than there is that burt is correct.
other peoples knowledge or 'understanding' means nothing, even when it's not even them speaking, but reports/reporters or writers or books and history speaking, it's just unbelievable how damn near no one qualifies with him.... even the bloody top writers and reporters from when these fighters were actually fighting, even other fighters statement get marginalised.
he could have said to Burt, " are you sure your not mistaken, or it must have been someone else" but NO he can't do that he just pounces like an unleashed bull and attempts to demolish everything in site. He is an ignorant man, with No Regard for his fellow man, NONE!
all i know is i am honoured....honoured...to have online correspondence with burt like i have the past few years.....to hear some of the first hand accounts and memories of his are gold-dust i think.....and to have the opportunity to converse with him about them....its a wonderful thing.
Oh god, you cant post on ESB so you have to expand your B.S. trying to make your grandpa seem like he was something more than he was here. Whatever. Youre a pathetic broken record who only has one interest: Discussing your grandad or his era in an agenda driven attempt to constantly circle back to beefing up his relatively modest legacy. It gets nauseating and if you dont like me calling you out on it then find something else to talk about. I have plenty of respect for other people and other fighters but I have a lot more respect for people who dont try to lie in order to give themselves or their relatives credibility. You talk about how I have no respect for reports and reporters. Anyone who knows me or the work I do knows that is absolutely incorrect. The difference between you and I, and your "work" and mine is that I actually use a consensus of reports to illustrate a time I have no first hand knowledge of. You, on the other hand, use only those reports that support your argument. The consensus doesnt so you reject it. Thats bad history and bad research and worse its willful, its not done out of ignorance which itself would be only partly excuseable. So lets curb the talk of who I DONT respect to a small minority of individuals that have no interest in the truth which includes you.no one attacks him, your just not allowed to disagree with him, he's always right.
other peoples knowledge or 'understanding' means nothing, even when it's not even them speaking, but reports/reporters or writers or books and history speaking, it's just unbelievable how damn near no one qualifies with him.... even the bloody top writers and reporters from when these fighters were actually fighting, even other fighters statement get marginalised.
he could have said to Burt, " are you sure your not mistaken, or it must have been someone else" but NO he can't do that he just pounces like an unleashed bull and attempts to demolish everything in site. He is an ignorant man, with No Regard for his fellow man, NONE!
I'm responding to other people before me klomp who already brought you up.
incidently Clump, your insulting statement has been addressed you numerous times before, Do you think your the only researcher in the world.
OTHER people are THOROUGH, Not just you.
I have approx. 3000 reports for my research, people who have read my book know that nothing in the book that's stated isn't backed by a report sited, I also put out a Scrapbook on Disc with approx. 300 reports and info, a few people also have that.
I also sold 100 years of Boxing History to the Hatton camp, organised and with a Categorized Itemized Folder, also with Pictures of how they could set up a Research & Resource section in their Hyde Gym. whether they have yet or not I can't say.
But 100 years of boxing they now have in Ring Magazines, Boxing News, other Mags & Periodicals, over 70 boxing text books and over 400 hundred fights on film.
I'd say that's pretty resourceful and THOROUGH on my part, and here's a shocker for you clump, other people in the world do the same and have a whole lot more than that even.
Not just you.
I have resourced everything I could get my hands on and I still seek and still gather more.
so once again you make a statement, 'ignore' peoples response to it, and pretend they have done nothing for their work... ask people who have seen or own the scrapbook, read the book or seen the collection I sold to the Hatton's
now it's on Record, AGAIN!!!
OTHER people are THOROUGH, Not just you.
I have approx. 3000 reports for my research, people who have read my book know that nothing in the book that's stated isn't backed by a report sited, I also put out a Scrapbook on Disc with approx. 300 reports and info, a few people also have that.
I also sold 100 years of Boxing History to the Hatton camp, organised and with a Categorized Itemized Folder, also with Pictures of how they could set up a Research & Resource section in their Hyde Gym. whether they have yet or not I can't say.
But 100 years of boxing they now have in Ring Magazines, Boxing News, other Mags & Periodicals, over 70 boxing text books and over 400 hundred fights on film.
I'd say that's pretty resourceful and THOROUGH on my part, and here's a shocker for you clump, other people in the world do the same and have a whole lot more than that even.
Not just you.
I have resourced everything I could get my hands on and I still seek and still gather more.
so once again you make a statement, 'ignore' peoples response to it, and pretend they have done nothing for their work... ask people who have seen or own the scrapbook, read the book or seen the collection I sold to the Hatton's
now it's on Record, AGAIN!!!
Doug.ie, I am also honoured to correspond with you lo these few years...Boxing has been my love since the early 1940s, and I am soall i know is i am honoured....honoured...to have online correspondence with burt like i have the past few years.....to hear some of the first hand accounts and memories of his are gold-dust i think.....and to have the opportunity to converse with him about them....its a wonderful thing.
happy to relate some first hand experiences related to those early days...Ciao...
If you don't mind me asking Burt. How old were you in 1950?
off topic burt...before esb went down yesterday...i think you asked a question about a boxer with a heart problem who got rejected by the army with over 100 fights......was it billy graham ??Doug.ie, I am also honoured to correspond with you lo these few years...Boxing has been my love since the early 1940s, and I am so
happy to relate some first hand experiences related to those early days...Ciao...
I've been wondering about that since yesterday as well.off topic burt...before esb went down yesterday...i think you asked a question about a boxer with a heart problem who got rejected by the army with over 100 fights......was it billy graham ??
first time graham met carmen basilio he cut him to shreds...i was reading about it recently, why his name was fresh in my mind.....if its him.I've been wondering about that since yesterday as well.
41 - 60 of 76 Posts
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