[Vic]

We always talk about overrated, underrated, fighters........but regarding power, what are your examples of huys that were known as punchers but were a bit overrated in that aspect in your opinion.

Ron Lyle for example, who was a pretty good fighter, we know, and could stop many people.....but it seems like he was not able to stop many elite heavyweights, right ? At least not like other guys..... He fought Bonavena, Quarry...he fought Peralta who was small, former lighheavy and all and couldn´t stop them.....And yet, Lyle is always mentioned as a powerful puncher, which he was, but in comparison with the elite punchers, no. SAme with Cleveland Williams, always referred as a big puncher.....
Maybe I´m being too harsh, I don´t know.....I´m sure some here thought about that before, but I don´t have any other examples, perhaps Valero is another one, plenty of times people mentioned him as a powerful puncher and he really wasn´t, as far 1 punch power goes anyway (Pitalua KO comes to mind though)......

Examples of this ?

 

[Bil1234]

We always talk about overrated, underrated, fighters........but regarding power, what are your examples of huys that were known as punchers but were a bit overrated in that aspect in your opinion.

Ron Lyle for example, who was a pretty good fighter, we know, and could stop many people.....but it seems like he was not able to stop many elite heavyweights, right ? At least not like other guys..... He fought Bonavena, Quarry...he fought Peralta who was small, former lighheavy and all and couldn´t stop them.....And yet, Lyle is always mentioned as a powerful puncher, which he was, but in comparison with the elite punchers, no. SAme with Cleveland Williams, always referred as a big puncher.....
Maybe I´m being too harsh, I don´t know.....I´m sure some here thought about that before, but I don´t have any other examples, perhaps Valero is another one, plenty of times people mentioned him as a powerful puncher and he really wasn´t, as far 1 punch power goes anyway (Pitalua KO comes to mind though)......

Examples of this ?

A lot of times the power isn't the problem with some fighters being unable to stop other fighters, it's the punch delivery or ability to consistently land the needed punches. Very, very few fighters had genuine 1 punch KO power (like Julian Jackson or Rocky Marciano) and most need to consistently land their bombs, even guys like George Foreman and Earnie Shavers.

As far as fighters with overrated power, in recent times I think Lucas Matthyse's power was getting exaggerated.

 

[Vic]

A lot of times the power isn't the problem with some fighters being unable to stop other fighters, it's the punch delivery or ability to consistently land the needed punches. Very, very few fighters had genuine 1 punch KO power (like Julian Jackson or Rocky Marciano) and most need to consistently land their bombs, even guys like George Foreman and Earnie Shavers.

As far as fighters with overrated power, in recent times I think Lucas Matthyse's power was getting exaggerated.

I agree 100%!
I disagree about Matthysse though, when you see those two lefts that he landed in Peterson, I see that the dude is a monstrous puncher IMHO.
Edit- actually, you are right too, a stoppage like that against Peterson (pretty good fighter but not exactly elite IMO, not exatcly a durable one either) is not a big proof or something I guess.....

 

[Mr. Brain]

Roberto Duran. In most of his lightweight title fight KO's he had to work on his opponents all night long to take them out.

 

[Mr. Brain]

We always talk about overrated, underrated, fighters........but regarding power, what are your examples of huys that were known as punchers but were a bit overrated in that aspect in your opinion.

Ron Lyle for example, who was a pretty good fighter, we know, and could stop many people.....but it seems like he was not able to stop many elite heavyweights, right ? At least not like other guys..... He fought Bonavena, Quarry...he fought Peralta who was small, former lighheavy and all and couldn´t stop them.....And yet, Lyle is always mentioned as a powerful puncher, which he was, but in comparison with the elite punchers, no. SAme with Cleveland Williams, always referred as a big puncher.....
Maybe I´m being too harsh, I don´t know.....I´m sure some here thought about that before, but I don´t have any other examples, perhaps Valero is another one, plenty of times people mentioned him as a powerful puncher and he really wasn´t, as far 1 punch power goes anyway (Pitalua KO comes to mind though)......

Examples of this ?

Agree with Cleveland Williams, I'm going against George foreman who said Cleveland was the hardest puncher he faced (must have faced him in sparring:huh )
Did Cleveland ever beat a contender? Maybe I'm missing something, nothing much from his record screams historic punching power.

 

[tommygun711]

A lot of times the power isn't the problem with some fighters being unable to stop other fighters, it's the punch delivery or ability to consistently land the needed punches. Very, very few fighters had genuine 1 punch KO power (like Julian Jackson or Rocky Marciano) and most need to consistently land their bombs, even guys like George Foreman and Earnie Shavers.

Couldnt you argue that Marciano had to land a high volume of punches to get the job done as well? Most of his stoppages were via accumulation and not 1 punch knockouts.

Agree with Cleveland Williams, I'm going against George foreman who said Cleveland was the hardest puncher he faced (must have faced him in sparring:huh )
Did Cleveland ever beat a contender? Maybe I'm missing something, nothing much from his record screams historic punching power.

Yeah, he drew with Machen (most felt Williams took the W, and yeah I know that doesnt necessarily show his power but you asked if he ever beat anyone), stopped Ernie Terrell and should've been granted a decison over him as well.

Williams may not have been the best fighter ever, or even the best contender of his era,but he certainly deserves a nod for his power. his personal issues caused a lot of setbacks and distractions.

 

[Sweet Pea]

Underrated punchers is the better thread to make. I always enjoy looking up fighters I'm not too clued in on. That's where Bill Jincock comes in with his favorite Peruvian boxers from the 60's.

As for overrated, I don't think I can say anything people don't already know. If I said Wilfredo Gomez, it's old news to most on this forum, even if people elsewhere wouldn't know where I was coming from.

 

[Theron]

We always talk about overrated, underrated, fighters........but regarding power, what are your examples of huys that were known as punchers but were a bit overrated in that aspect in your opinion.

Ron Lyle for example, who was a pretty good fighter, we know, and could stop many people.....but it seems like he was not able to stop many elite heavyweights, right ? At least not like other guys..... He fought Bonavena, Quarry...he fought Peralta who was small, former lighheavy and all and couldn´t stop them.....And yet, Lyle is always mentioned as a powerful puncher, which he was, but in comparison with the elite punchers, no. SAme with Cleveland Williams, always referred as a big puncher.....
Maybe I´m being too harsh, I don´t know.....I´m sure some here thought about that before, but I don´t have any other examples, perhaps Valero is another one, plenty of times people mentioned him as a powerful puncher and he really wasn´t, as far 1 punch power goes anyway (Pitalua KO comes to mind though)......

Examples of this ?

Well Bonavena and Quarry were some tough cookies to crack, and Foreman couldnt stop Peralta
in the first fight and only got him in the tenth the next time they fought. Although when i think of
Lyle i do think moderate to good puncher with good boxing skill I don't really think puncher but he
could crack some.

I think Williams was a big puncher with speed but didn't have enough else (skill wise) to use his
power to its highest potential. Foreman rated him with Cooney etc so i'd say he was an elite puncher.

 

[Lester1583]

I think Lucas Matthyse's power was getting exaggerated.

Matthysse's skills were more overrated than his power.

 

[Flea Man]

Edwin Valero. Certainly one of the worst finishers I've ever seen as well.

 

[Gunner]

There's a big difference between huge power, and the ability to DELIVER that huge power

 

[dyna]

Earnie Shavers and Rocky Marciano

Pacman also

 

[MadcapMaxie]

Earnie Shavers and Rocky Marciano

Pacman also

I don't understand why so many say Shavers in particular it's like the go-to name for overrated power. Bar Curtis Sheppard there is nobody else who is that consistently ranked the hardest puncher by all who faced him. For those who say that most of those boxers just say his name because they beat him I recall back at ESB somebody quoting a journeymen (Forgot the name) who said to the effect "George Foreman hit about as hard as Ron Lyle, but Shavers hit harder than both combined". People then say take a look at his record he never KO'd a solid chinned, quality fighter but that has nothing to do with Shaver's power but his boxing abilities which were fairly poor. Poor stamina, poor delivery of punches and a horrid finisher. In terms of 1 shot power I don't recall any fighter having that sort of impact on Ali or Holmes. I love what Tillis said "He can turn July into June and sent me over the motherfucking moon".

 

[It's Ovah]

Earnie Shavers is the number one culprit. Wlad of late tends to get overrated regarding his one punch power. It generally takes a few pinpoint shots before an opponent goes down. Compared to Lennox or Tyson he falls a step short.

Agree with those saying Valero. Heavy handed no doubt, but not the huge puncher he was portrayed as. Matthysse is the same today.

Max Baer never impressed me as a puncher.

Earnie Shavers and Rocky Marciano

Pacman also

Marciano's overrated as a puncher only if you include him as a heavyweight. P4P however, he was fearsome. His KO highlights do tend to overshadow his lesser performances though.

 

[dyna]

I don't understand why so many say Shavers in particular it's like the go-to name for overrated power. Bar Curtis Sheppard there is nobody else who is that consistently ranked the hardest puncher by all who faced him. For those who say that most of those boxers just say his name because they beat him I recall back at ESB somebody quoting a journeymen (Forgot the name) who said to the effect "George Foreman hit about as hard as Ron Lyle, but Shavers hit harder than both combined". People then say take a look at his record he never KO'd a solid chinned, quality fighter but that has nothing to do with Shaver's power but his boxing abilities which were fairly poor. Poor stamina, poor delivery of punches and a horrid finisher. In terms of 1 shot power I don't recall any fighter having that sort of impact on Ali or Holmes. I love what Tillis said "He can turn July into June and sent me over the motherfucking moon".

Henry Cooper shook Ali harder than any man ever shook Ali.
Though that shot from Shavers that dropped Holmes was picture perfect, beautifully stepped in and great use of leverage with his "strange" frame (broad shoulder, very long legs, long arms).
But many very limited fighters could punch like that, the difference being that Shavers was skilled enough to land such a haymaker from time to time.

 

[Flea Man]

Earnie Shavers is the number one culprit. Wlad of late tends to get overrated regarding his one punch power. It generally takes a few pinpoint shots before an opponent goes down. Compared to Lennox or Tyson he falls a step short.

Agree with those saying Valero. Heavy handed no doubt, but not the huge puncher he was portrayed as. Matthysse is the same today.

Max Baer never impressed me as a puncher.

Wlads right hand is overrated and his left hand, the real beast, he doesn't use as much.

Marciano's overrated as a puncher only if you include him as a heavyweight. P4P however, he was fearsome. His KO highlights do tend to overshadow his lesser performances though.

 

[Flea Man]

Roberto Duran. In most of his lightweight title fight KO's he had to work on his opponents all night long to take them out.

Still. He carried his power up to middleweight. Power isn't just sparking someone.

 

[Mr. Brain]

Still. He carried his power up to middleweight. Power isn't just sparking someone.

:huh Ummmm, wat? I thought that was the whole idea of punching power. Duran was working really really hard and he hit these guys often and with full force (even fleetfoot Bizzarro and Fernandez). Duran seemed to think power was about KOing guys. Are you sure that punching power isn't about trying to render your boxing opponent inert? Don't you feel you need to think this out a little?

 

[Flea Man]

:huh Ummmm, wat? I thought that was the whole idea of punching power. Duran was working really really hard and he hit these guys often and with full force (even fleetfoot Bizzarro and Fernandez). Duran seemed to think power was about KOing guys. Are you sure that punching power isn't about trying to render your boxing opponent inert? Don't you feel you need to think this out a little?

So powerful punchers are only the sort that finish a bout with one or two punches? You can't be powerful if you only stop your opponent and badly hurt them, only if you render them completelt unconscious like Bob Foster? Maybe you need to have a little think.

'Duran seemed to think' no, Duran seemed to think battering his opponent was the name of the game. Mong.

Anyway, who overrates Durans power? That is the thread. Who claims he was a Julian Jackson-esque bomber at 135?

Durans power, made up of his accuracy, timing and speed, is solid and he carried that up to World ranked opposition at middleweight, and a big middle at that.

I'd say his power is ranked just fine. What you are saying is just how most class him as a puncher.

 

[jorodz]

i'm on the shavers and williams bandwagon here: they had power but shit delivery systems but when your reputation, and what reputations, are built on what fighters say about you rather than results i'm a bit skeptical.

totally agreed on ron lyle, who i thought was more skilled than slugger. his punching power was good but never great imo